Mark Bass combo. 121H -v- 102P

[fretmeister]

Anyone tried these two back to back?

When my Ampeg / TecAmp rig goes I'm pretty sure I'll be getting one of these. Of course no bugger has them both in stock to try them out.

Anyone used them both? Which did you prefer and why please?

ta

[Paul S]

Add the 151 to the comparison and I'll be glued to this thread too.

[Paul_C]

[quote name='fretmeister' post='810503' date='Apr 18 2010, 05:45 PM']Anyone tried these two back to back?

When my Ampeg / TecAmp rig goes I'm pretty sure I'll be getting one of these. Of course no bugger has them both in stock to try them out.

Anyone used them both? Which did you prefer and why please?

ta[/quote]


Have you checked [url="http://www.bassdirect.co.uk/"]http://www.bassdirect.co.uk/[/url] for stock ?

not far from us.

[Paul_C]

[quote name='Paul_C' post='810641' date='Apr 18 2010, 07:52 PM']Have you checked [url="http://www.bassdirect.co.uk/"]http://www.bassdirect.co.uk/[/url] for stock ?

not far from us.[/quote]

the bass player in the band I drum for has the 1x12 version, which is fine (i.e. very loud from where I sit) for small venues and would no doubt be D.I.'d for a larger one and so working as a perfectly useable monitor.

[xgsjx]

I haven't tried any of the other mb combos, but the 102 is certaintly loud enough for most gigs & it's easier to add a choice of 2x10, 4x10 or 1x15 cabs if you was playing a large venue (& look like one rig).

I suppose it depends on what speaker configuration you're after as they both have the LM II(I) (as if you didn't know).

[alanbass1]

I would go for the 121H - I find the piezo tweeters on Markbass cabs too 'scratchy' and not pleasant at all (I disconnected the piezo on my 121P combo and it is all the better for it)

[machinehead]

It depends on how much volume you need.

The 121H is a lovely amp and would be my first choice. The 2 x 10 might be a little louder and has a beautiful sound but, as posted above, the tweeter can sound a bit harsh.

I did have a Markbass 1 x 15 cab which I used with the LMII ( And LM I before that) and it was a sweet sounding cab too.

Best setup I had was a pair of Markbass 2 x 10s. One cab for small gigs, two for bigger rooms. A bit expensive for this setup but worth it for the sound and flexiblity.

You could always buy the 121H and add a 1 x 12 cab later if you find you need it?

Frank

[The GroovyPlucker]

[quote name='machinehead' post='810858' date='Apr 18 2010, 10:35 PM']It depends on how much volume you need.

The 121H is a lovely amp and would be my first choice. The 2 x 10 might be a little louder and has a beautiful sound but, as posted above, the tweeter can sound a bit harsh.

I did have a Markbass 1 x 15 cab which I used with the LMII ( And LM I before that) and it was a sweet sounding cab too.

Best setup I had was a pair of Markbass 2 x 10s. One cab for small gigs, two for bigger rooms. A bit expensive for this setup but worth it for the sound and flexiblity.

You could always buy the 121H and add a 1 x 12 cab later if you find you need it?

Frank[/quote]

Have just bought the 121H combo, but finding it a little bit weak, have only gigged it twice, but was gonna buy a NY 1x15 to go with it, but am really unsure now, could trade for a 3x10 combo? I like a good bit of grunt from my bass set up, but found that missing, there was a defined sound there, but not much oomph. Any one reckon adding a 1x15 might give me that, or would a mesa walkabout jhave that more edge, thoughts

The GroovyPlucker

[JTUK]

Big fan of the 102 combo and I use 12" cabs now which I also really like...but the 12's sound so much better as a pair.
If you could use a 12" combo plus a 12" etn by MB, I think this would be a close rum thing bewteen the combos, IMV.

so, 102 combo plus 2x10 cab V 112 combo plus 12 cab....hmmm ??? nice dilemma.

Not sure if MB do a single 12" though..but I'd keep them matched up speaker-wise, if I could.

[guybrush threepwood]

[quote name='The GroovyPlucker' post='825287' date='May 2 2010, 04:03 AM']Have just bought the 121H combo, but finding it a little bit weak, have only gigged it twice, but was gonna buy a NY 1x15 to go with it, but am really unsure now, could trade for a 3x10 combo? I like a good bit of grunt from my bass set up, but found that missing, there was a defined sound there, but not much oomph. Any one reckon adding a 1x15 might give me that, or would a mesa walkabout jhave that more edge, thoughts

The GroovyPlucker[/quote]

The NY 15 is a great cab; really deep, but tight and focused as well. However, it does have the piezo tweeter discussed above. I've found this can sound good on a fretted bass, as it adds a lovely glassy top end (as long as you don't have it turned up too high). However, if you use distortion / overdrive, you'll want to turn it off completely, as it makes the tweeter sound like a wasp farting.

[fretmeister]

Thanks chaps...

as it happens I traded my TecAmp wide 2x12 for a TecAmp narrow 2x10 and got a Mrk Bass F1 head.

Very very light indeed with a lovely clear sound.

[The GroovyPlucker]

[quote name='guybrush threepwood' post='825328' date='May 2 2010, 09:17 AM']The NY 15 is a great cab; really deep, but tight and focused as well. However, it does have the piezo tweeter discussed above. I've found this can sound good on a fretted bass, as it adds a lovely glassy top end (as long as you don't have it turned up too high). However, if you use distortion / overdrive, you'll want to turn it off completely, as it makes the tweeter sound like a wasp farting. [/quote]


Other possibilty I've thought of was swapping the 1x12 combo for a 2x10 combo with the 1x15 underneath giving me back my preferred set of 1x15 2x10. I live in Northern Ireland, and there's feck all shops over here, so can't get my hands on stuff to try. BTW you can turn off the tweeter then?

The GroovyPlucker

[guybrush threepwood]

[quote name='The GroovyPlucker' post='825474' date='May 2 2010, 01:24 PM']Other possibilty I've thought of was swapping the 1x12 combo for a 2x10 combo with the 1x15 underneath giving me back my preferred set of 1x15 2x10. I live in Northern Ireland, and there's feck all shops over here, so can't get my hands on stuff to try. BTW you can turn off the tweeter then?

The GroovyPlucker[/quote]

Yeah, all the cabs have a tweeter control on the side, something which is missing from the combos. To be honest, for my tone, I find that I don't normally use the tweeter - Mark Bass speakers tend to be punchy as heck anyway.

[The GroovyPlucker]

[quote name='guybrush threepwood' post='825491' date='May 2 2010, 01:36 PM']Yeah, all the cabs have a tweeter control on the side, something which is missing from the combos. To be honest, for my tone, I find that I don't normally use the tweeter - Mark Bass speakers tend to be punchy as heck anyway.[/quote]


I see you have the Jeff Berlin Combo and a 1x15, how does it sound for you, plenty of punch I guess, but does it have warmth and grunt, me's thinking MB is more for Bass twiddlers & noodlers in the upper registry? I like the root bottom end grunt, but need portability, can also noodle, but need that warmth as well as tightness, am I looking in the wrong place, or just got the wrong set up?

The GroovyPlucker

[Musicman20]

[quote name='The GroovyPlucker' post='825628' date='May 2 2010, 04:44 PM']I see you have the Jeff Berlin Combo and a 1x15, how does it sound for you, plenty of punch I guess, but does it have warmth and grunt, me's thinking MB is more for Bass twiddlers & noodlers in the upper registry? I like the root bottom end grunt, but need portability, can also noodle, but need that warmth as well as tightness, am I looking in the wrong place, or just got the wrong set up?

The GroovyPlucker[/quote]

From what I hear the Jeff Berlin is pure old school with the modern Markbass sheen! A nice combo!

[xgsjx]

Don't be fooled by the word punchy. The 2X10 combo has plenty of depth & bassiness to shake things with.
Next door to the rehearsal rooms that we practice in there is an arts & crafts room. I've moved things off of the shelves many times without having to go into the A&C room (they hate me apparently).

[JMT3781]

We have both in stock at TR Music in walsall, if thats nearby for you.

I prefer the 1x12, mainly because of its size and shape.

i love my mark bass 4x10's but the 2x10 combo didnt really do it for me

[guybrush threepwood]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='825746' date='May 2 2010, 06:35 PM']From what I hear the Jeff Berlin is pure old school with the modern Markbass sheen! A nice combo![/quote]

I don't think it's that old school; yes it's a 15 with no tweeter, but warm isn't a term I'd use to describe it. It's certainly got a great deal of low end, but it's not wooly, just incredibly clear and pure.

As for the whole setup, it really sounds great - loads of depth and bass, with so much punch. I used to use a 4x10 and I hated 15s, thought they were dull and toneless, but markbass converted me!

[alanbass1]

[quote name='guybrush threepwood' post='825491' date='May 2 2010, 01:36 PM']Yeah, all the cabs have a tweeter control on the side, something which is missing from the combos. To be honest, for my tone, I find that I don't normally use the tweeter - Mark Bass speakers tend to be punchy as heck anyway.[/quote]

I disconnected the tweeter in my CMD121P combo and it made a world of difference. The 12" speaker alone has enough top end for me and I don't miss the spittyness of the piezo at all.

Edited May 3, 2010 by alanbass1

[Musicman20]

[quote name='guybrush threepwood' post='826176' date='May 3 2010, 08:29 AM']I don't think it's that old school; yes it's a 15 with no tweeter, but warm isn't a term I'd use to describe it. It's certainly got a great deal of low end, but it's not wooly, just incredibly clear and pure.

As for the whole setup, it really sounds great - loads of depth and bass, with so much punch. I used to use a 4x10 and I hated 15s, thought they were dull and toneless, but markbass converted me![/quote]

Sounds perfect! I must admit I have heard it briefly and it sounded great. I was never a massive 15s fan but the Orange converted me so I'd definitely consider the Jeff Berlin at some point.

[Grand Wazoo]

I have tried 4 of the Mark Bass combos as follows:

The Jeff Berlin 1 x 15" CMD151P
The 1 x 12" CMD121H
The 2 x 10" CMD102P
The 3 x 10" CMD103H

All of these feature the same head which was the Little Mark Combo head a rebadged Little Mark II head, for some reason that head is renamed Combo Head when fitted to a combo but it is exactly the same as the Mark II, they have all been upgraded now with the Little Mark III head which only difference is the addition of a Line Out volume pot for the DI link.

As many people said it all boils down to taste and personal preference. But let me first say one thing here for all those who don't like the piezo tweeter, it is foolish to disconnect it because it operates through a crossover circuit and essentially it doesn't come into play unless you tweak your eq to the higher frequencies, if you keep your high EQ reasonably flat and you use the VLE (Vintage Loudspeaker Emulator) without activating the other filter the VPF (Variable Pre-Shape Filter) which enhances both low and highs in a V-shape then you can be certain that you will never have your sound going through the piezo tweeter.

Now that we have crushed that silly preconception we can elaborate the difference between the 4 Combos.

The Jeff Berlin 1 x 15" is the one which bellows potent lows but obviously lacks the clear top end definition, good for vintage fans but not so for slappers and those who like to use distortion.

The 1 x 12" is a cross between the the Jeff Berlin and the 2 x 10", but somehow it's not as loud as the 2 x 10" and also it has a sound which to me at least was less appealing, somehow it reminded me of a cheap TNT Peavey, 1 x 12 as far I have experienced in my years of playing is not the best cab solution for a bass, not here nor there if you know what I mean.

The 2 x 10 CMD102P seems to tick all the right boxes, it has clarity, and the magic of it is the natural compression that emanates from the 2 x 10" speakers format with the onboard circuit is the best match of them all. Every note played is an aural sculpture, you get the feeling that you can see the big dollops of sound as well as hear them, it's that good, to me at least.
[url="http://www.markbass.it/risorse/allegato_pro.php?id=103"]http://www.markbass.it/risorse/allegato_pro.php?id=103[/url]

The CMD103H - 3 x 10" jobbie well that is just silly and overkill in my views, yes it plays just as good as the 2 x 10" but while that extra speaker adds volume it takes away that magic definition that the 2 x 10" gives.

Eventually after a lot of careful consideration I bought the 102P which I happily run for a year and then 2 months ago I have upgraded the head to the Litttle Mark Tube 500 which has made this combo the best thing in the world in my book, the Mark Bass UK distributors (Proel UK) did the swap for me and they told me this is the only one in the world with that head in that combo!

Edited May 3, 2010 by Grand Wazoo

[Musicman20]

Good review! Very thorough. I must admit I only had a brief go on the LMTube. I emailed Peter Murray and he said it's not for any tube dirt, just a warmth which is apparent at louder volumes, plus you get a nice colour and other features. That combo looks cool.

I think if I go Markbass cabs, I'll get a couple of 2x10s or their new NY122 which is 4 ohms. Actually, yep, I'd personally go for the 212 just so I've got all power into one cab. I was tempted by a 4x10 but they are pretty large.

[allighatt0r]

Wazoo, does tilting the 2x10 combo back affect the way the sound goes round the room? Or does it just make it louder for people standing next to it?


Thanks!

[alanbass1]

[quote name='Grand Wazoo' post='826348' date='May 3 2010, 12:09 PM']As many people said it all boils down to taste and personal preference. But let me first say one thing here for all those who don't like the piezo tweeter, it is foolish to disconnect it because it operates through a crossover circuit and essentially it doesn't come into play unless you tweak your eq to the higher frequencies, if you keep your high EQ reasonably flat and you use the VLE (Vintage Loudspeaker Emulator) without activating the other filter the VPF (Variable Pre-Shape Filter) which enhances both low and highs in a V-shape then you can be certain that you will never have your sound going through the piezo tweeter.

Now that we have crushed that silly preconception we can elaborate the difference between the 4 Combos.[/quote]

From my perspective it is not a preconception. I bypassed the crossover and connected the 12" speaker direct to the amp out on my CMD121P combo and the improvement in sound is way above what is was having to 'dial out' the spitty piezo. It certainly had more 'presence' than was previously heard with the crossover/piezo in circuit. Using the VLE did more to the sound than take out the piezo - that was my choice and the sound for me is so much the better for it. What Markbass should have done is include an attenuator for the piezo as they do with their cabs. But they don't and maybe bypassing the crossover, which is not the highest quality item I have come across, has more benefits than just getting the piezo out of the circuit as it might be that this component some of the life out of the sound.

Edited May 4, 2010 by alanbass1

[Musicman20]

I never realised Markbass didn't have a control for the high end on the piezo? Is this true on all of their combos?!