TC Electronics - Potential new 'Amp Tweaker' for the RH450. Testing to commence very soon!

[Musicman20]

Hi guys. I'm VERY excited to be announcing this. Uffe Hansen at TC Electronic has invited 5 TalkBass users to particpate in a test group for the RH450 and an internal beta version of a PC application that allows the user to access internal settings on the Preamp. The connection between the RH450 to the PC is facilitated by a special USB-to-Midi cable that connects to the "Remote" port on the back panel of the RH450.

The users who were invited are:

KJung
Vic
Tom7
Musicman20 (me!)
Eublet

None of us are endorsers, but we have been very enthusiastic about the RH450 for a while now, and have rambled on at length in many threads here about these heads, the potential they provide, and how we would like to be able to adjust this or that under the hood. Uffe and TC have noticed this so they're going to let us give it a go.

We have freedom to post our discussions here, and hopefully to get ideas for things to try from others. So please participate in the discussion with us. We can not however share the Tweaker PC application with anyone so please don't ask!

I want to give a very special thanks to Uffe and TC Electronic for asking us to particpate and provide feedback. This is the kind of thing you want to see from a manufacturer as it shows they care about what their users are interested in. So many here have made suggestions and Uffe has noticed them. So here we go!

HERE is a link the the Talkbass thread where the discussions are going to take place: [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=652395"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=652395[/url]

Below is a partial cut and paste from an email Uffe sent us which explains a few things about what we're doing.

[quote]Originally Posted by [b]Uffe Hansen[/b] via [b]email[/b] to test group

[u][b]The Gear[/b][/u]
As mentioned in my earlier mail, I will send you a test amp and the equipment to hook up the Amp Tweak software.
I will send more specific instructions for the amp tweaker shortly, but overall it is a pretty simple Control software hooked up to the RH450 via a USB-MIDI interface and a special MIDI split cable connected to the ‘remote’ connector on RH450.

[u][b]The Tweaker[/b][/u]
The Tweaker is a subset of a development tool that we’ve been using internally since the initial RH450 prototypes passed audio. We’ve cleaned it up a bit to not make it overly complicated.

This first version allows you access to:
Full parametric Tone control section (Bandwidth, Gain, Freq, all four bands)
Overall Lowpass filter – Internally known as TweeterTone and much discussed on TB
Full access to the three band SpectraComp parameters – Thrs, Attack, Release etc. for all three bands (yes it’s a lot ;-
Storing/recalling of tweaked settings on your computer – which also means easy exchange of settings between you guys
And finally change of selected parameter defaults on the amp

[u][b]The test aim[/b][/u]
My intention with this test is to start an open discussion on what makes sense for bass players both from a sound and tone perspective, but also in potentially opening the Amp Tweaker up to more players out there.
We don’t have a specific target in terms of product release, end date or features that we need to reach, but hey maybe we will find some underway!

In other words; we simply wanted to gain some input for new angles and ideas for bass players at the front end of the development process rather than lurking at forums and making all decisions ourselves.

This of course also means that I cannot promise the outcome of the test, so no guarantees on where this will end up. That said, I am personally VERY excited about this and convinced that we will find some cool new stuff that we can get out there.

[u][b]Confidentiality[/b][/u] – The Amp Tweaker is basically an internal tool and not a product for re-sale. Our test is fully official and you are free to discuss this with anybody out there.[/quote]

Edited April 28, 2010 by Musicman20

[cheddatom]

That's pretty cool, but, if you wanted all that flexibility, wouldn't you just buy a programmable pre-amp/multi effects unit?

[molan]

Sounds like a nice idea.

The clever thing (for me anyway) is that I'd never have the patience to tweak away on my settings until I found the perfect one. However my TC is already loaded with three pre-sets taken straight from people at TB & they are all really usable.

Being able to exchange settings & compare notes via mail or forum that have been created by someone who really knows what they are doing sounds really useful

[Musicman20]

I think one of the main features is going to be the low pass filter. Those craving even more sparkle and more bright high end will now be able to get it.

Im guessing they used a similar type of technique to get the Staccato 51 flat settings.

[daz]

Hmm, i have to say i never heard of them. I suppose their pretty good? Unless i come into money i cant see me ever getting any boutique amps sadly.

[Musicman20]

[url="http://www.tcelectronic.com/bass.asp"]http://www.tcelectronic.com/bass.asp[/url] for a rundown of what TC make for bass.

They are more famously known for their recording and effects equipment...pretty high end stuff.

Now, they have a line of Bass amps/cabs. Excellent equipment.

[Urban Bassman]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='822071' date='Apr 28 2010, 04:01 PM']Hi guys. I'm VERY excited to be announcing this. Uffe Hansen at TC Electronic has invited 5 TalkBass users to particpate in a test group for the RH450 and an internal beta version of a PC application that allows the user to access internal settings on the Preamp. The connection between the RH450 to the PC is facilitated by a special USB-to-Midi cable that connects to the "Remote" port on the back panel of the RH450.

The users who were invited are:

KJung
Vic
Tom7
Musicman20 (me!)
Eublet

None of us are endorsers, but we have been very enthusiastic about the RH450 for a while now, and have rambled on at length in many threads here about these heads, the potential they provide, and how we would like to be able to adjust this or that under the hood. Uffe and TC have noticed this so they're going to let us give it a go.

We have freedom to post our discussions here, and hopefully to get ideas for things to try from others. So please participate in the discussion with us. We can not however share the Tweaker PC application with anyone so please don't ask!

I want to give a very special thanks to Uffe and TC Electronic for asking us to particpate and provide feedback. This is the kind of thing you want to see from a manufacturer as it shows they care about what their users are interested in. So many here have made suggestions and Uffe has noticed them. So here we go!

HERE is a link the the Talkbass thread where the discussions are going to take place: [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=652395"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=652395[/url]

Below is a partial cut and paste from an email Uffe sent us which explains a few things about what we're doing.[/quote]

As a fellow RH450 enthusiast - would be very interested to be kept informed of any developments on this. Could a great amp about to be made even better...can't wait

[Kiwi]

I'm a little puzzled as to how someone is going to tweak the settings for live use without having a laptop on stage during soundcheck.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Crazykiwi' post='822274' date='Apr 28 2010, 06:18 PM']I'm a little puzzled as to how someone is going to tweak the settings for live use without having a laptop on stage during soundcheck.[/quote]

I think the thinking behind it is so people can totally change the flat settings beyond the semi-parametric EQ. One of the main requests is for the option of more high end/sparkle, which mean basically before you gig, you plug it in, tweak it, then use it...and you still have your 3 presets and semi para EQ to change it live.

[Kiwi]

So you're only going to be able to work on the basis of very general parameters for the basic colouring of the amp?

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Crazykiwi' post='822352' date='Apr 28 2010, 07:35 PM']So you're only going to be able to work on the basis of very general parameters for the basic colouring of the amp?[/quote]

These are the areas you can tweak on the first version....

Full parametric Tone control section (Bandwidth, Gain, Freq, all four bands)
Overall Lowpass filter – Internally known as TweeterTone and much discussed on TB
Full access to the three band SpectraComp parameters – Thrs, Attack, Release etc. for all three bands (yes it’s a lot ;-
Storing/recalling of tweaked settings on your computer – which also means easy exchange of settings between you guys
And finally change of selected parameter defaults on the amp

[Kiwi]

Hmm, I think you might need to describe how the parametric settings are changed above and beyond what is available through the front panel. Otherwise I still don't understand what the benefits of extra eq. tweakability in a gigging environment might be.

Otherwise three user settings = three models of bass.

[alanbass1]

I have to say that I'm really happy with how they have voiced the RH450, which I preferred over the Stacatto '51 I tried. I'm guessing what would be most useful would be to get my favourite setting and reset this as 'flat' with regard to control settings - but not sure if I would like to do this either. Notwithstanding what I think it is good that the manufacturer is engaging with the users of their gear and not just looking for big name endorsee's.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Crazykiwi' post='822468' date='Apr 28 2010, 09:36 PM']Hmm, I think you might need to describe how the parametric settings are changed above and beyond what is available through the front panel. Otherwise I still don't understand what the benefits of extra eq. tweakability in a gigging environment might be.

Otherwise three user settings = three models of bass.[/quote]

Basically, and this is all I know, you could more than likely change the amp to sound almost Markbass like by adding extra high end (the RH450 only gives you so much high end on the front panel. Thats one big change. The others, like being able to tweak the inner workings of the Spectracomp, and not just set the level, are going to be quite interesting as well.

Say you like the RH450, but you really want a setting on your PC/Mac for those more modern /crisp/clear bass tone,s (you can nearly get it at the moment, but its more vintage voiced) you could plug it in, allow a lot more high end and sparkle than the front panel gives you, then use it. Then you can change it back if you like.

Its not for everyone, just those who really want to tweak and have ultimate flexibility.


[quote name='alanbass1' post='823274' date='Apr 29 2010, 06:28 PM']I have to say that I'm really happy with how they have voiced the RH450, which I preferred over the Stacatto '51 I tried. I'm guessing what would be most useful would be to get my favourite setting and reset this as 'flat' with regard to control settings - but not sure if I would like to do this either. Notwithstanding what I think it is good that the manufacturer is engaging with the users of their gear and not just looking for big name endorsee's.[/quote]

Me too, the RH450 flat is more my thing cf to the Staccato, but having a setting with a much brighter high end would be fun! Not that I use much high end, but it would be nice to have the option. I think what they are saying is it opens up the options even more.

Who knows what it will lead to. They have no set idea as yet, we are just testing to see what happens. Perhaps it will be an additional 'extra' for the RH450 owners to choose if they want.

[Dood]

[subscribed]

[krispn]

I think its great to see a company go to the end users first and see what happens.....

We can all debate the usefulness, practicality etc but as most of us now have some sort of pc/mac at home. Touring guys are likely to have a macbook/laptop and the flexibility that this kind of application has would allow someone, if they were inclined, to redesign their amp to their exact spec for any gig.

For many that might be a tweak to far as we buy gear that we like the tone of in the first place but its like having amp modeller software that you can then bounce into a head and take to the gig. I think that will be the next step in ampdesign/modeller desigh like that orange pc amp thing. TC are clever and I for one can't wait to see how this and their future developments pan out. Oh and Uffe, if you're reading, when are we gonna see the Nova pedals for bass - a Bass dirt box for instance? My guitarist bought her Nova pedals after being impressed with my RH450. Lets see the bass range soon OK

Edited May 2, 2010 by krispn

[peted]

Very cool idea. I was intrigued when they mentioned the prototype head they used to develop the Staccato head. A glimpse at the prototype looked like it wasn't all that different externally to the normal RH450. I wondered if they still have something like a USB header internally on the PCBs.

Seems that the RH450 is getting even more interesting features even after it has been released! I love the fact you can do that with digital amps.

[Musicman20]

My software has been emailed, the amp and cable has arrived, and now I just need to find some time t have a good fiddle, especially with the high end.

I know a fair few amount of players would buy this amp if it opened up at the high end (personally I like it how it is, but if you ant Markbass-type sizzle, it can be done with this software).

There are a few clips up by KJung on youtube. Link to one of them here, (the rest can be found here also): [url="http://www.youtube.com/Kjungbass"]http://www.youtube.com/Kjungbass[/url]

Unfortunately I dont have the technology to be able to actively compare on a video like Ken has, but Im hoping at some point to basically do two different videos, and let one be the amp flat, no changes, and the other with the high end tweaked. Although Ken's example definitely works, (I suggest headphones and no background noise, with a fairly high volume).

[Conan]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='822071' date='Apr 28 2010, 04:01 PM']Hi guys. I'm VERY excited to be announcing this. Uffe Hansen at TC Electronic has invited 5 TalkBass users to particpate in a test group for the RH450 and an internal beta version of a PC application that allows the user to access internal settings on the Preamp. The connection between the RH450 to the PC is facilitated by a special USB-to-Midi cable that connects to the "Remote" port on the back panel of the RH450.[/quote]

I [i]almost[/i] understood that...

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Conan' post='829446' date='May 6 2010, 11:35 AM']I [i]almost[/i] understood that... [/quote]

Im a computer noob; I dont really know that much about how this all works, but Im getting there.

Basically, a cable goes from the back of the RH450 (the remote footswitch port) into your computer via USB. Thats it, then the program does the rest.

[Conan]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='829454' date='May 6 2010, 11:42 AM']Basically, a cable goes from the back of the RH450 (the remote footswitch port) into your computer via USB. Thats it, then the program does the rest.[/quote]

OK. Sounds like keyboards territory to me!

[wateroftyne]

I should have picked up on this on the TB thread, but I can't find it... is this a modded version of the head, or a stock RH450?

[Musicman20]

[quote name='wateroftyne' post='829499' date='May 6 2010, 12:18 PM']I should have picked up on this on the TB thread, but I can't find it... is this a modded version of the head, or a stock RH450?[/quote]

Ill get some pictures up. Apparently it is the same amp, but they have sent 'test' units so we dont have to use our own.

It looks like ones they use in the office for testing eg not ones they would sell at retail...

[Bigwan]

I think it sounds like a software tool for the current head. Guys over on TB getting very excited - don't know why. They may never offer it for sale.

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Bigwan' post='829505' date='May 6 2010, 12:24 PM']I think it sounds like a software tool for the current head. Guys over on TB getting very excited - don't know why. They may never offer it for sale.[/quote]
True, true...

I'm one of the people who think TC got the parameters right first time, but I can see why some people might want more sparkly sizzle..