MusicMan SUB's

[Kev]

Lets not get into a fender type arguement. As the SUBs are made in USA you would expect they would be better quality instruments, but as with fender the cheaper built SBMM may produce the odd gem.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Kev' post='833758' date='May 10 2010, 11:07 PM']Lets not get into a fender type arguement. As the SUBs are made in USA you would expect they would be better quality instruments, but as with fender the cheaper built SBMM may produce the odd gem.[/quote]

But the SBMM range aren't cheaper than the SUB. They arent budget versions of the SUB, they are budget versions of the SR and Sterling.
For around £300 they are nice basses, im not denying that, but i still think the Ray34 is built better and has a better finish.


Just my thoughts (again).

[Ou7shined]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='833813' date='May 10 2010, 11:58 PM']But the SBMM range aren't cheaper than the SUB. They arent budget versions of the SUB, they are budget versions of the SR and Sterling.
For around £300 they are nice basses, im not denying that, but i still think the Ray34 is built better and has a better finish.


Just my thoughts (again).[/quote]
Isn't the new price on a SBMM a fair bit less than what the SUBs were selling for when they were new?
I'd agree that the finish could be better on the SBMM (only seen photos mind) but I can't see how they could be built better - I had no quibbles with mine in that respect at all. I'd go as far as saying that my SUB was put together better than any Fender I've had and equally as good as my 'ray.

[theplumber]

Having owned a pre Ernie Ball Stingray....I think the sub sounds and plays just as well.....it sometimes comes down to money....I sold the Stingray for£950 a couple of years ago. I was not playing it at all,and at the time had no intention of gigging again,also....being self employed I was skint and the sale paid the bills and let me continue my business through a bad patch. In the last years I have been buying and selling guitars on e bay...trying things out and slowly working back up to a guitar that feels and sounds right.....this Sub bass does it for me,and may be the nearest I get to my Stingray.I played it the other day when it arrived and it really is a terific guitar! I have a Tokia jazz bass,SX vintage series Jazz,a Squier Silver series jazz.....this Sub tops them all! The finish is ok.....it had been lightly relicted...but looks ok....I may paint it out,but thats about it.....I will be using it at the next gig.....yes....very happy with the Sub!

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Ou7shined' post='833830' date='May 11 2010, 12:22 AM']Isn't the new price on a SBMM a fair bit less than what the SUBs were selling for when they were new?
I'd agree that the finish could be better on the SBMM (only seen photos mind) but I can't see how they could be built better - I had no quibbles with mine in that respect at all. I'd go as far as saying that my SUB was put together better than any Fender I've had and equally as good as my 'ray.[/quote]

I didnt know there was a new price for the SBMM, ive not noticed any price drop since Christmas.

I know the Subs are well built, so are Squiers and loads of other cheap (and expensive )instruments. My comments are really only comparing my SUB to my Ray34, not Fenders or any other bass.

Im not talking about how well they are put together, but how they feel, play and look. I didnt like the painted neck at all. And i found the non contoured body a bit strange.

I've not seen many second hand Ray34's but if there is less than £100 difference, and im basing this on a SUB for £350-£400 and a Ray34 for around £400 then i dont think the SUB is the outright winner, just because its made in the USA and nails a certain tone.

I made my choice because, to me, the Ray34 feels like a classier instrument, i much prefer a glossy finish, the matching headstock (in fact the whole look of it is just perfect to me), the neck feels smoother, i prefer a contoured body and im getting to like the 3EQ.

The last few posts give me the impression that people are assuming the Sub is better and have not directly compared them to the SBMM.

Maybe ive been a bit harsh on the Sub as i did like it at the start but im much happier with the Ray34, i even sold off my Lakland because i use the Ray34 all the time.


Sorry to the OP if this thread has gone too far off course.

Edited May 11, 2010 by dave_bass5

[Hutton]

It's all really a bit subjective. 'One man's meat is another man's poison' so to speak. I had a Ray and a SUB. I sold the Ray because I preferred the sound of the SUB. My Ray had that weak G string thing no matter what I did to it. The SUB was and is even across the strings. The build quality is pure USA Ernie Ball so you know what you're getting. I know that my SUB is a keeper, and I suspect it will rise in value in the passage of time due to the relatively short production run. The Ray34 I have no doubt is an excellent working instrument. However, if you want a piece that is going to rise in value it seems it has to have 'Made in USA' stamped on it.

[dave_bass5]

Both my Ray and the weak G thing and i did fix it on the Sub but cant on the Ray34. Ive even changed the pup.
Its not bad, and i can control it but its still bugging me and putting me off getting a SR4 in the future.

I know what you mean about having to have Made in USA on it. I was quite proud that my Sub had this on it. Sad i know.

They do come out of the same factory as the Skyline range by Lakland though, thats encouraging as well all know (except Gareth;-) how well Skylines are made.

Edited May 11, 2010 by dave_bass5

[Grand Wazoo]

[quote name='Hutton' post='833992' date='May 11 2010, 10:02 AM']It's all really a bit subjective. 'One man's meat is another man's poison' so to speak. I had a Ray and a SUB. I sold the Ray because I preferred the sound of the SUB. My Ray had that weak G string thing no matter what I did to it. The SUB was and is even across the strings. The build quality is pure USA Ernie Ball so you know what you're getting. I know that my SUB is a keeper, and I suspect it will rise in value in the passage of time due to the relatively short production run. The Ray34 I have no doubt is an excellent working instrument. However, if you want a piece that is going to rise in value it seems it has to have 'Made in USA' stamped on it.[/quote]

Those are entirely my thoughts too. The SUB will be extremely sought after in the years to come, and in less than 10 years it'll probably reach legend status, can you say the same about an Indonesian SBMM?

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Grand Wazoo' post='834109' date='May 11 2010, 12:17 PM']Those are entirely my thoughts too. The SUB will be extremely sought after in the years to come, and in less than 10 years it'll probably reach legend status, can you say the same about an Indonesian SBMM?[/quote]

All subjective so ill not get sucked in to that one.

I do see more SUB's for sale now than i do SBMM. Make of that what you will ;-)

[Musicman20]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='834003' date='May 11 2010, 10:14 AM']Both my Ray and the weak G thing and i did fix it on the Sub but cant on the Ray34. Ive even changed the pup.
Its not bad, and i can control it but its still bugging me and putting me off getting a SR4 in the future.

I know what you mean about having to have Made in USA on it. I was quite proud that my Sub had this on it. Sad i know.

They do come out of the same factory as the Skyline range by Lakland though, thats encouraging as well all know (except Gareth;-) how well Skylines are made.[/quote]

Id definitely try a few more EBMM Stingrays (perhaps 2 band) before worrying about the weak G string being consistent. Perhaps even try the new models

[Ou7shined]

(Slightly OT but) I'm not sure what to think about this weak G phenomenon. When I first got my 'ray I was showing it off to a fellow bassist (who was very well informed but had little first hand knowledge) he loved the sound of the bass but commented that it had a quiet G string - it so totally didn't - but because he'd read about it he then thought he could hear it. Also, I've just built a bass using a genuine 'ray pup (2006 I believe) which was take out of it's original home because of it allegedly having a quiet G (the replacement Nordy fixed his problem) but when I put it in my project bass, you guessed it, no quiet G - in fact sometimes I think it's too loud when popping. I've had 2 Fender '51 pups with weak E strings but to date no probs with MM pups. Maybe I've been lucky.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Ou7shined' post='834190' date='May 11 2010, 01:22 PM'](Slightly OT but) I'm not sure what to think about this weak G phenomenon. When I first got my 'ray I was showing it off to a fellow bassist (who was very well informed but had little first hand knowledge) he loved the sound of the bass but commented that it had a quiet G string - it so totally didn't - but because he'd read about it he then thought he could hear it. Also, I've just built a bass using a genuine 'ray pup (2006 I believe) which was take out of it's original home because of it allegedly having a quiet G (the replacement Nordy fixed his problem) but when I put it in my project bass, you guessed it, no quiet G - in fact sometimes I think it's too loud when popping. I've had 2 Fender '51 pups with weak E strings but to date no probs with MM pups. Maybe I've been lucky. [/quote]

Im convinced its a EQ/Freq and technique thing. Ive done all the set up adjustments and changed the pup to a Nordy in the Ray34. To be honest i didnt notice much improvement. The Sub was a bit easier to fix as i leveled the pole pieces. It seemed to do the trick. Still not as loud as my Duck Dunn but better than it was.

When i play with a pick (most of the time) and dont cut the mids or highs its fine. It doesnt jump out like my previous basses (P's and Jazz) but its there. when i boost the lows or cut the mids, some notes on the G string almost disappear, normally at the first 5 or six frets. I only ever hear this when im playing along to music or gigging, not just playing on my own.
Just doing the usual root octave thing is when i notice it more. Im not a slapper (not on bass anyway ;-) but when i pop the G occasionally its pretty damn loud so no, i dont think its a volume issue as such. I've also check the levels using the input on my PC and all strings seem to read about the same, with everything set flat.

I have gig recordings that do prove its not just my imagination. I do think that if everyone else can live with it then i can. Its not a big deal.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='834206' date='May 11 2010, 01:41 PM']Im convinced its a EQ/Freq and technique thing. Ive done all the set up adjustments and changed the pup to a Nordy in the Ray34. To be honest i didnt notice much improvement. The Sub was a bit easier to fix as i leveled the pole pieces. It seemed to do the trick. Still not as loud as my Duck Dunn but better than it was.

When i play with a pick (most of the time) and dont cut the mids or highs its fine. It doesnt jump out like my previous basses (P's and Jazz) but its there. when i boost the lows or cut the mids, some notes on the G string almost disappear, normally at the first 5 or six frets. I only ever hear this when im playing along to music or gigging, not just playing on my own.
Just doing the usual root octave thing is when i notice it more. Im not a slapper (not on bass anyway ;-) but when i pop the G occasionally its pretty damn loud so no, i dont think its a volume issue as such. I've also check the levels using the input on my PC and all strings seem to read about the same, with everything set flat.

I have gig recordings that do prove its not just my imagination. I do think that if everyone else can live with it then i can. Its not a big deal.[/quote]

Agreed its an EQ/Freq issue.

Some notice it and some dont. The amp/cab/technique probably reveals things.

Personally, It doesnt put me off Stingrays at all.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='834218' date='May 11 2010, 01:51 PM']Agreed its an EQ/Freq issue.

Some notice it and some dont. The amp/cab/technique probably reveals things.

Personally, It doesnt put me off Stingrays at all.[/quote]

I would say it doesn't put me off stingrays, as im happy with my Ray34 and not about to give up on MM but it does make getting a "real" SR4 a harder decision.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='834229' date='May 11 2010, 01:57 PM']I would say it doesn't put me off stingrays, as im happy with my Ray34 and not about to give up on MM but it does make getting a "real" SR4 a harder decision.[/quote]

I havent looked into it much, but does the 2 band have the reported issue?

If not, SR5 is calling you

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='834235' date='May 11 2010, 02:07 PM']I havent looked into it much, but does the 2 band have the reported issue?

If not, SR5 is calling you [/quote]

Well as my SUB had it (to my ears) and its a 2EQ im guessing they might.
And if this "weak" G string is a MM thing wouldn't a SR5 also have it?

[Ou7shined]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='834206' date='May 11 2010, 01:41 PM']Im convinced its a EQ/Freq and technique thing....[/quote]
Yeah that makes better sense to me too.

My 'ray is a 2eq and no limp G string here.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='834248' date='May 11 2010, 02:18 PM']Well as my SUB had it (to my ears) and its a 2EQ im guessing they might.
And if this "weak" G string is a MM thing wouldn't a SR5 also have it?[/quote]

Apparently the Ray 5 doesnt suffer from it at all.

"StingRays are generally known for the punch of their sound, making them very suitable for rock/funk applications and excellent for slapping, and for being of extremely high build quality. The 6-bolt neckplate is an example of this. The neck is also quite wide, especially compared to that of Fender Jazz Bass-type models, as well as having the above-mentioned truss-rod adjustment mechanism that allows players to adjust the truss-rod without removing the neck. Some users have also noticed an audible difference in volume between the lower three strings (E, A, D) and the highest G string, with the G string suffering from a lack of volume. This problem has not been observed in 5-string StingRays."

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_Man_StingRay"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_Man_StingRay[/url]

No idea if its true but Ive not heard of it on a Ray 5.

[dlloyd]

I used to notice it (weak G) on Ashdown amps, but less so on Ampeg or Trace amps.

[cameltoe]

I'm fed up of this post now.

I'm GASSING for a SUB!

Someone let me trade my Fret King for one! I'm getting a GAS headache

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='cameltoe' post='834281' date='May 11 2010, 02:56 PM']I'm fed up of this post now.

I'm GASSING for a SUB!

Someone let me trade my Fret King for one! I'm getting a GAS headache[/quote]

Im now gassing for a RAY35 :-(

Edited May 11, 2010 by dave_bass5

[Ou7shined]

And now I want my old S.U.B. back.

[faceman]

And the Bass Gallery is posting my SUB back to me as I want to give it another ago. The 2EQ-G String thing has been bantering around so much. It seems to vary from bass to bass, string to string and hands to hands

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='faceman' post='834375' date='May 11 2010, 04:35 PM']And the Bass Gallery is posting my SUB back to me as I want to give it another ago. The 2EQ-G String thing has been bantering around so much. It seems to vary from bass to bass, string to string and hands to hands [/quote]


I knocked the A and D pole pieces down and that certainly helped a bit.

[luckman67]

I really like my SUB & the fact that not only did I get it for a silly price,but it's made at the same factory using the same pickup & active 2 band eq as the Classic Stingray 4H.