Blues band standards

[stevie]

If you were auditioning for a blues band, what songs would you have to know to be taken seriously?

[neilb]

Most blues standards use a walking I IV V pattern, using a minor pentatonic or blues scales. I dont think theres any need to learn specific songs as they mostly are based around this.

[thepurpleblob]

Been there... failed miserably. Blues is one of those things where the complexity is masked by the apparent simplicity. While it's true that you will get by with a few walking lines and some approaches based around I IV V, in a *real* blues band you will be found out in seconds. There's a lot of subtlety to the blues. I think listening to it every day for 30 years may be the solution.

[Happy Jack]

+1

Playing blues is a lot like learning Go, the ancient strategy game.

You can learn the basics in about five minutes, and then spend the rest of your life trying to get really good at it.

Apart from anything else, just the word "Blues" covers a multitude of styles.

What sort of blues were you planning to play? Can you mention some of the artists you'd like to emulate?

[RichardH]

[url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Blues-Bass-Essential-Styles-Techniques/dp/0634089358/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1273753972&sr=8-1-spell"]This is well worth a read[/url] - introduces some standards, as well as some of the phrases you'll get chucked at you - e.g. - "it's a quick IV with a turnaround"

[chris_b]

[quote name='stevie' post='836042' date='May 13 2010, 11:57 AM']....If you were auditioning for a blues band, what songs would you have to know to be taken seriously?....[/quote]
You might need to know some of the following; slow blues, medium blues, fast blues, funky blues, blues rumba, shuffles, 2, 4, 8 and 16 beats to the bar, 8 bar, 12 bar, 16 bar, 24 bar patterns, 2/4, 3/4, 4/4, 6/8, all the possible stops and riffs and then you'll have to play with drive and fluency, lock with the drummer, track the guitarist closely and, if you're lucky, listen to the brass riffs. You can be subtle or brash but don't overplay.

And don't play Red House. That's one of the worst blues on record!

Edited May 13, 2010 by chris_b

[derrenleepoole]

If the OP means blues songs where the bassline 'IS' the song (in essence), then compositions like Born Under A Bad Sign are the way to go. There are a myriad of other examples, but my brain is tired

[El Bajo]

+1 to the Ed Friedland blues book. I go to Stevie ray Vaughn for my blues fix (get the essential collection) and for a more abstract Blues rock I go for Cream. Check out Booker T and the MGs for Donald Dunns awesome lines (also plays the bassin the Blues Brothers stuff)

[Bloodaxe]

[quote name='stevie' post='836042' date='May 13 2010, 11:57 AM']If you were auditioning for a blues band, what songs would you have to know to be taken seriously?[/quote]

Ask them for their set list & go off & learn it.

A few goodies to have in the bag if they're not in the list:

The Thrill Is Gone - BB King (has a surprise 6th)
Tore Down - Freddie King, loads of others (stop-tastic!)
Crosscut Saw - Albert King (Rhumba)
Let The Good Times Roll - Louis Jordan, BB King & others (II-V-I turnaround)
Stormy Monday - T-Bone Walker (straight I-IV-V), and The Allman Brothers (not) - you'll be needing both.
Bright Lights, Big City and Baby, What You Want Me to Do - Jimmy Reed
Key To The Highway - Clapton amongst loads of others (I-V-IV)
Killing Floor - Howlin' Wolf, Jimi Hendrix (aka The Lemon Song off Led Zep II)
My Babe - Little Walter (Swinging I-V-IV verses, Walking II-V-I on the solo)
Boom Boom - John Lee Hooker.


[quote name='neilb' post='836113' date='May 13 2010, 01:10 PM']Most blues standards use a walking I IV V pattern, using a minor pentatonic or blues scales. I dont think theres any need to learn specific songs as they mostly are based around this.[/quote]



Whilst largely true, this tells me that you're probably not a Blues player.

Mystery Train - Elvis
Red Hot - Billy Lee Riley

Try those two as straight-8 I-IV-V's & see what happens

[quote name='derrenleepoole' post='836244' date='May 13 2010, 03:13 PM']If the OP means blues songs where the bassline 'IS' the song (in essence), then compositions like [b]Born Under A Bad Sign[/b] are the way to go. There are a myriad of other examples, but my brain is tired [/quote]
Good call that man. Crops up a lot & it's [u][i]not[/i][/u] one to approach blind, very quirky structure.

Pete.

[doctorbass]

Its also worth having a good root/5th 12 bar pattern up your sleeve for playing something different on a standard like Mojo Working


Just to add to that, if the drummer isnt a real blues drummer (and plenty who say they are actually aren't!) it can get very difficult no matter how good your blues chops are!!

Edited May 13, 2010 by doctorbass

[Wil]

I think blues is really very tricky to do right. It's all in the feel, for the most part, but there is a lot of depth there that might not be apparent to the casual observer.

And of course, unlike jazz, if you get it wrong, you can't say you did it on purpose

[3V17C]

Must admit I was always one to dismiss blues bass playing as 'easy' and up to a point, yes it is. However having just recently joined a bluesy band with a [i]very[/i] accomplished blues guitarist I have found there's more to it than initially meets the eye!

One thing I would add to what others have already said is to play with feel and listen out for light and shade/when to bring it down etc.



peace

C

[JTUK]

Well, I am not a blues player but I have done a lot of blues gigs which is all down to the gtr IMV.

Certain songs might have a riff which you'll be able to pick up after the first turn....they are virtually all pretty standard.
Far better to be conversant when someone calls a fat shuffle or whatever as that means you'll have to get the groove in the first bar or so or be found out. If the band doesn't have a horn then rip things from 'Chigaco' to swing it....but the drummer will take you there.

Two things about a blues band... the gtr has to have something to say and the drummer has to have a slant on his playing IMV... be that a funky element or straight ahead...I prefer the former and you need to get with him very quickly as you could be playing a version of the same progresion pretty often.
A good blues band is great to see...an average one should always be avoided, IMO.

Unless the band is rehearsed you need good ears and to be quick into the songs call 'feels'...and if playing with a horn get with his keys and hand signals.

[OldGit]

You'll almost certainly need "Need your love so bad" done in the Fleetwood Mac stlye. You also need to know the difference between that and Stormy Monday as they have some similar odd quirks.

But any band worth auditioning for will give you a set list with versions and keys and, say, three tunes to learn for the audition.

Assuming you can actually play, auditions are more about whether you get on together than if you know the 1967 original version of "Born under a bad sign" by Albert King or one of the 30 or so cover versions there have been (Homer Simpson's is my favourite )
If they tell you that's the version they play and you do your best to learn it for the audition that should be OK as it shows a good attitude and willingness to learn and work on things. That's much more important than nailing the exact right bass line but having a poor attitude or not being a nice person.
If you say "well it's new to me but I learned it best I can" you'll win. If you turn up and say "oh yeah. I've heard it a few times but but I didn't have time/couldn't be arsed/didn't think you were worth the effort to actually put any work in before now" then that says a lot about you and you'll probably not get the gig ...


So, be proactive, ask them what they want to play at the audition and learn the tunes. That also shows a professional approach to it from you - [b]remember you are auditioning them too.[/b]

Also buy this month's Guitar and bass magazine and read the letter about Dr Feelgood vs your average pub rock blues band .. That will help too

[OldGit]

and if you really want to worry .. read this [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_blues_standards"]Wikipedia list of Blues Standards[/url]

[Marvin]

[quote name='Wil' post='836272' date='May 13 2010, 03:40 PM']I think blues is really very tricky to do right. It's all in the feel, for the most part, but there is a lot of depth there that might not be apparent to the casual observer.

And of course, unlike jazz, if you get it wrong, you can't say you did it on purpose [/quote]

Very true.
Loads of people just think it's dum da dum da dum. But when you actually find out what is being played there's a lot more to it. There's the feel and all those little licks and fills..... and so on.

[stevie]

Lots of good advice here - thanks, guys - although I was thinking of running for the hills until I read OldGit's message. This is not an existing band but one that is being formed, though some of the members have played together before. So there isn't such a thing as a set list yet (and the band may not turn out to be strictly 100% blues).

I'm aware of how tricky some of these tunes can be. For example, I'd find 'Still Got the Blues' impossible to busk, and unless you nail the bass line fairly closely, it will simply sound wrong. Ditto for 'Need Your Love so Bad'. I do think it's a good plan to learn a number of specific songs thoroughly before the first 'meet'. After all, you wouldn't audition for a soul band without knowing Knock on Wood. I'll try to get an idea of specific tunes next time we talk.

I'm also going to find our what a fat shuffle is.

[JTUK]

[quote name='stevie' post='836365' date='May 13 2010, 04:53 PM']I'm also going to find our what a fat shuffle is.[/quote]


it will certainly suss the drummer out if he looks at you all mystified...

start here for a basic shuffle

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQ4jqn-Kgvc"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQ4jqn-Kgvc[/url]

dum de dum... only REALLY laying it down. Ask them if they want it straight ( root notes ) or triads or whatever.
If they don't really have an opinion, then this is all good for you as they are jamming as well...

[OldGit]

[quote name='stevie' post='836365' date='May 13 2010, 04:53 PM']Lots of good advice here - thanks, guys - although I was thinking of running for the hills until I read OldGit's message. This is not an existing band but one that is being formed, though some of the members have played together before. So there isn't such a thing as a set list yet (and the band may not turn out to be strictly 100% blues).

I'm aware of how tricky some of these tunes can be. For example, I'd find 'Still Got the Blues' impossible to busk, and unless you nail the bass line fairly closely, it will simply sound wrong. Ditto for 'Need Your Love so Bad'. I do think it's a good plan to learn a number of specific songs thoroughly before the first 'meet'. After all, you wouldn't audition for a soul band without knowing Knock on Wood. I'll try to get an idea of specific tunes next time we talk.

[b]I'm also going to find our what a fat shuffle is.[/b][/quote]

Ha ha yeah.. Let me know when you find out

In the circumstances you could take control of your destiny and propose some tunes in the genre that you know or feel you can learn. Then the onus is on them to do the work too
I'd raid the Joe Bonamassa tune list for some classics.

In reality the initial tune list will probably depend on the singer and what they know. However you should all agree the same 4 or 5 numbers (max) to do at the first meet, the keys and who's version you are doing. Beware of things like "The Thrill is gone - BB King version" as there's about 10 recorded versions by BB and they are subtly different.

You could try "They called for Stormy Monday but Mustang Sally is just as bad" by Tom Principato
[url="http://open.spotify.com/track/4OcWqiNH3C9865FYp7RBVJ"]http://open.spotify.com/track/4OcWqiNH3C9865FYp7RBVJ[/url]
A song about every band playing the same few standards, night after night

Spotify and You tube are your friends here

[stevie]

[quote name='OldGit' post='836401' date='May 13 2010, 05:28 PM']Ha ha yeah.. Let me know when you find out [/quote]
According to JTUK, it's Blueberry Hill - not a problem. :-)

I've got most of the music in my collection (including Joe Bonamassa) - I just wasn't sure what's in the 'core repertoire' nowadays. I have a better idea now.

[TankJon]

+1 for Joe Bonamassa ...great guitar player and writes some great blues/rock!

I've done a few blues gigs with a guitarist who refused to tell us what songs we were going to play till the night. My self, the drummer and the keyboardist all had to stand fixated on his fretboard and many a time during a "jam" at one of these gigs we would end up going to change to the IV only to have to improvise some sort of mad 2 way keys/bass run back to the I because the guy was still quite happily noodling over the I.
It was a bit of a mad set-up to be honest but a good laugh.

[OldGit]

[quote name='TankJon' post='836428' date='May 13 2010, 06:00 PM']+1 for Joe Bonamassa ...great guitar player and writes some great blues/rock!

I've done a few blues gigs with a guitarist who refused to tell us what songs we were going to play till the night. My self, the drummer and the keyboardist all had to stand fixated on his fretboard and many a time during a "jam" at one of these gigs we would end up going to change to the IV only to have to improvise some sort of mad 2 way keys/bass run back to the I because the guy was still quite happily noodling over the I.
It was a bit of a mad set-up to be honest but a good laugh.[/quote]

Oh I recognise that scenario.

I go to some jam sessions where some players don't tell you what they are doing. You end up guessing the chord from the thumb position on the back of their guitar neck

The other extreme is the guy who tells you he's playing an original tune and then tells you the chord changes all the way through a bog standard 12 bar blues Sure mate, totally original ...

[JTUK]

Well, wasn't sure if you were used to certain ways of playing things and the terminology.
If we all know what a shuffle is, then a fat one is bigger and heavier, so more gtr based and stompin...

Depending on who the gtr is... they might well just bark out the key ...if you are lucky..and and the more sorted horn or keys will indicate the groove and any changes.

The gtr will expect you to be able to follow his chord shape if the changes are unusual as he is probably singing as well..

If you use Youtube, agree, make sure you all use the SAME referenece

If in doubt I let the drums start and catch him on bar 3 as that can be better than jumping in and missing it completely with what the drummer is playing.

But like all these things, it is either a free for all..where everyione has to be on their toes and follows the leader or you have a structure that everyone knows..

[derrenleepoole]

I love being in a blues band more than an originals band... and easy it ain't. I find that the real challenge is keeping your ideas fresh, while at the same time laying down a solid foundation for the rest of the band to work from. We can play anything up to 25 - 30 songs for a nights gig, and that's a lot of I-VI-V structures to play (or variations thereof). Knowing when and what to play is crucial I think to being a good blues bassist. If all the song requires is a thump on the roots, but it makes the tune, then do it right and in time and still take pride in it. So what if you're can't be doing your amazingly impressive Adam Nitti fill - if it ain't broke, don't fix it

[gjones]

[quote name='Bloodaxe' post='836264' date='May 13 2010, 03:32 PM']Ask them for their set list & go off & learn it.

A few goodies to have in the bag if they're not in the list:

The Thrill Is Gone - BB King (has a surprise 6th)
Tore Down - Freddie King, loads of others (stop-tastic!)
Crosscut Saw - Albert King (Rhumba)
Let The Good Times Roll - Louis Jordan, BB King & others (II-V-I turnaround)
Stormy Monday - T-Bone Walker (straight I-IV-V), and The Allman Brothers (not) - you'll be needing both.
Bright Lights, Big City and Baby, What You Want Me to Do - Jimmy Reed
Key To The Highway - Clapton amongst loads of others (I-V-IV)
Killing Floor - Howlin' Wolf, Jimi Hendrix (aka The Lemon Song off Led Zep II)
My Babe - Little Walter (Swinging I-V-IV verses, Walking II-V-I on the solo)
Boom Boom - John Lee Hooker.

Pete.[/quote]


+1
Remember dynamics too. There's nothing duller than a blues band that without dynamics especially during a slow blues. If you bring a slow blues up to a crescendo, then down to a whisper during a solo the audience will really take notice. And check out a few minor key blues such as 'who's been talking' by howling wolf and 'long grey mare' by Fleetwood Mac.