Problem with my new UL212. Need advice

[bassbluestew]

[quote]lol.. Dave, I think the only thing wrong with my rig is what's commonly known as the 'human condition' !!!!! lol Why cant we just be happy with our tone? Always having to fudge with it all the time![/quote]

Thank the good lord it's not only me........I really, really love my Mesa Boogie 400+ and Ashdown 810 and the band has a huge van and lots of folk who really don't mind helping me move it, so why oh why am I looking at other rigs - and seriously !!

My good lady is even more perplexed than I am..................now when I say "This is THE rig" she just either laughs and / or shakes her head. This is the good lady who spent a long afternoon with me ( and at that point two small kids ) in Overwater trying and buying EA gear, saying all the right thingas and not flinching as I wrote out a HUGE cheque ! What a girl. !!!

S

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='bassbluestew' post='18313' date='Jun 15 2007, 03:09 PM']This is the good lady who spent a long afternoon with me ( and at that point two small kids ) in Overwater trying and buying EA gear, saying all the right thingas and not flinching as I wrote out a HUGE cheque ! What a girl. !!!

S[/quote]

That a one in a million lady you have there.
I just get all my gear delivered to my work and then get my drummer to pick it up so mine never see's it.

[Dood]

[quote name='BigRedX' post='18302' date='Jun 15 2007, 02:43 PM']Surely the combination of letters and numbers: UL-610 constitutes an oxymoron?[/quote]

lol.. it only weighs 37Kg.. it's an easy 1 man lift, considering my ole Hartke 4.5's were 45Kg each! ;o)

[OldGit]

[quote name='obbm' post='18238' date='Jun 15 2007, 01:00 PM']It does raise the question as to what is wrong with your existing rig?[/quote]


The ash trays are full

[alexclaber]

Dave, whilst you've got the speakers out I'd really like to see some photos of the inside of the UL cabs, just trying to get an idea of how they brace things to make them quite so light!

Alex

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='18645' date='Jun 15 2007, 11:51 PM']Dave, whilst you've got the speakers out I'd really like to see some photos of the inside of the UL cabs, just trying to get an idea of how they brace things to make them quite so light!

Alex[/quote]

Alex
I have one of each driver in the cab at the moment but when the other B&C arrives during the week ill take them both out and get some shots for you.

[OldGit]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='18645' date='Jun 15 2007, 11:51 PM']Dave, whilst you've got the speakers out I'd really like to see some photos of the inside of the UL cabs, just trying to get an idea of how they brace things to make them quite so light!

Alex[/quote]


To refer back to a question way back up the thread, isn't [i]that [/i](and the sound) the stuff that makes a cab with two 100 Euro drivers worth £800?
It's the R&D ..
OG

Edited June 16, 2007 by OldGit

[Dood]

he he!! there's a certain amont of exasperation when you look at the cost of these boxes then look at whats inside them!! ;o)

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='OldGit' post='18684' date='Jun 16 2007, 05:09 AM']To refer back to a question way back up the thread, isn't [i]that [/i](and the sound) the stuff that makes a cab with two 100 Euro drivers worth £800?
It's the R&D ..
OG[/quote]

Maybe but compare the UL212 at $999 and the Dr Bass BL212 at $459. Both cabs seem very, very similar. Even the weight is only 1lb difference yet the UL212 cost double. plus the BL212 is hand made (and im guessing by someone better than the guy who made my UL212) just like the UL is.

[alexclaber]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='18834' date='Jun 16 2007, 04:00 PM']Maybe but compare the UL212 at $999 and the Dr Bass BL212 at $459. Both cabs seem very, very similar. Even the weight is only 1lb difference yet the UL212 cost double. plus the BL212 is hand made (and im guessing by someone better than the guy who made my UL212) just like the UL is.[/quote]

Direct sales vs retailer sales makes up most of the difference in price. Epifani are probably only getting about $500 for their cabs from the retailers, if it makes you feel any better!

If I'm not mistaken Epifani prices have come down a little since the launch of the Series II, as the Eminence woofers are less expensive (but just as good) as the B&C woofers.

Alex

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='18859' date='Jun 16 2007, 05:05 PM']Direct sales vs retailer sales makes up most of the difference in price. Epifani are probably only getting about $500 for their cabs from the retailers, if it makes you feel any better!

If I'm not mistaken Epifani prices have come down a little since the launch of the Series II, as the Eminence woofers are less expensive (but just as good) as the B&C woofers.

Alex[/quote]

I guess you are right, maybe Epifani sohuld sell direct as well.

[alexclaber]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='19061' date='Jun 17 2007, 09:40 AM']I guess you are right, maybe Epifani sohuld sell direct as well.[/quote]

They can't because then they'd undercut their dealers! Catch 22.

Alex

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='19089' date='Jun 17 2007, 11:13 AM']They can't because then they'd undercut their dealers! Catch 22.

Alex[/quote]

Yeah, just be nice if they could though.
Schroeder manage it ok.

Edited June 17, 2007 by dave_bass5

[obbm]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='19112' date='Jun 17 2007, 12:19 PM']Yeah, just be nice if they could though.
Schroeder manage it ok.[/quote]

Unfortunately that's the realities of the commercial world. Next you'll be wanting to buy directly for Fender, Gibson, EBMM, Warwick, Ampeg, Ashdown, EBS, Boss, Electro Harmonix, Line 6, etc., etc.

If you could then their overheads would be so great that the prices would go up dramatically to cover the costs and you would save nothing. A small company like Schroeder can probably afford to do it at the moment but once they get larger and have a dealer network it will it will certainly stop.

[Dood]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='18859' date='Jun 16 2007, 05:05 PM']Direct sales vs retailer sales makes up most of the difference in price. Epifani are probably only getting about $500 for their cabs from the retailers, if it makes you feel any better!

If I'm not mistaken Epifani prices have come down a little since the launch of the Series II, as the Eminence woofers are less expensive (but just as good) as the B&C woofers.

Alex[/quote]

and that does actually make me feel better about the price tag ;o) I am a bargain hunter and I am only prepared to pay what I feel something is worth.. and some of the gear I have bought has tested me in that respect a bit. It sounds amazing, but should the price tage really be so high (pretty much a given in the UK) - I guess we just have to get used to the extra costs that are slapped on top for shipping, mark up and the mysterious "boutique kit tax" that appears to be levied on all 'non mainstream' gear. That aside, the last 5 cabs I have had from different manufacturers have all been stunningly good.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='obbm' post='19120' date='Jun 17 2007, 12:49 PM']Unfortunately that's the realities of the commercial world. Next you'll be wanting to buy directly for Fender, Gibson, EBMM, Warwick, Ampeg, Ashdown, EBS, Boss, Electro Harmonix, Line 6, etc., etc.

If you could then their overheads would be so great that the prices would go up dramatically to cover the costs and you would save nothing. A small company like Schroeder can probably afford to do it at the moment but once they get larger and have a dealer network it will it will certainly stop.[/quote]

yes i take your point.

Going OT here i posted this over on TB but seeing as they are all still in bed ill post this here to see if anyone can help

Last night i had the worst sound ever at a gig. Using my MB SA450 and UL115.
We were playing on a wooden stage so i know things weren't perfect but i have played the place 5-6 times with this set up and always get a nice full sound. last night i couldn't get any real lows out of it and it seems like i didn't have enough headroom although i had enough volume. my sound was very thin and compressed sounding. lots of mids.
I was wondering if putting rubber feet on the cab made a difference. Have i decoupled the cab from the floor by doing this. My Schroeder 1210 has them and that sounds fine. I put them on to stop the cab moving around on stage as it has been recently but this is the first time i have used it like this. Could just be one of those nights i guess as i was also getting a bit of hiss through my cab as well. and my wireless system was noisy as well.
Thanks for any advice.

[Dood]

oooh cricket Dave! I'm not sure how I can help with your situation! Bizarrely I have found the opposite with the wooden stages I have played on. I'm usually asked to pull my bottom end back a bit as the stage seems to rattle in polite sympathy!

I take it the rig sounds ok today? Mebbe just a bad room?

[obbm]

I would say put it down to one of those nights. I've had probelms with wooden stages but it's easier to cut the bass back rather than try and find something that may not be there.

For ease I put castors on a Trace 4x10 years ago. It sounded dreadful. It just lost everything so I took them off again. Could well be the same effect with your rubber feet. I keep my rigs on wheeled trolleys in the garage and they all sound thin but take them out and put them on the floor, even outdoors and they are normal.

Yesterday I played a local festival using the house Trace rig, a 1x15 combo and a 2x10 cab. It sounded aweful standing directly in front of it. The 15-inch seemed to fart down at G and F on the E-string and it was so clanky. I was in two minds whether to use my own or risk it. A number of the other bands used the house rig and it sounded great out front so I left mine in the car and went for it. Still sounded weird on stage but good result where it mattered.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='dood' post='19126' date='Jun 17 2007, 01:04 PM']oooh cricket Dave! I'm not sure how I can help with your situation! Bizarrely I have found the opposite with the wooden stages I have played on. I'm usually asked to pull my bottom end back a bit as the stage seems to rattle in polite sympathy!

I take it the rig sounds ok today? Mebbe just a bad room?[/quote]

I wont get to try the rig out before my next gig with that band. In fact it might be the last gig with the UL115 as im hoping the UL212 will be back up and running by then.
Im really after thoughts about putting the feet on the cab. Im ok about the wooden stage as as i said i have played it before and it sounded great. only difference is the feet. Just wanted clarification that the sound will change by putting the feet on and this si what i was hearing.
I have had a reply over on TB about this and its what i thought so maybe ll take them off again.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='obbm' post='19128' date='Jun 17 2007, 01:08 PM']For ease I put castors on a Trace 4x10 years ago. It sounded dreadful. It just lost everything so I took them off again. Could well be the same effect with your rubber feet.[/quote]

I think you are right. When i get the cab back to my work ill give the cab a try with and without, just to make sure but the UL115 has never let me down before so ill put it down to the feet and "one of those nights".
Im hoping this loss of low end was also making my wireless system sound noisy as well. I have heard this beofre but that was through a full PA with the highs truned up as the sound guy was trying to convince me not to use it. I still used it last night and it didnt really cause a problem, it was more when i was setting up without the band playing that i heard it.

[bassbluestew]

Before you go taking the feet off, why not try it again.........if it still sounds p*sh,, flip the cab in its side ( i.e. the side with no rubber feet thus re-coupling it with the stage ) and see how that sounds. If it STILL sounds p*sh, it ain't the rubber feet.

I have rubber feet on my ABM810 and big the biggest casters I've ever seen on my Basson B210B and neither seems fo affect the sound adversely.

BTW I used the small (???) Basson cab at a gig last night in a tiny venue, where we had our full brass section and a tiny pa ( we normally use this pa for foldback/sidefill). Nine of us in a wee space and it sounded killer. The Basson cab rocked like a rocking thing.

S

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='bassbluestew' post='19145' date='Jun 17 2007, 02:10 PM']Before you go taking the feet off, why not try it again.........if it still sounds p*sh,, flip the cab in its side ( i.e. the side with no rubber feet thus re-coupling it with the stage ) and see how that sounds. If it STILL sounds p*sh, it ain't the rubber feet.

I have rubber feet on my ABM810 and big the biggest casters I've ever seen on my Basson B210B and neither seems fo affect the sound adversely.

BTW I used the small (???) Basson cab at a gig last night in a tiny venue, where we had our full brass section and a tiny pa ( we normally use this pa for foldback/sidefill). Nine of us in a wee space and it sounded killer. The Basson cab rocked like a rocking thing.

S[/quote]

I really wished i had thought about turning the cab over. I did on the way home but that was too late.
If i have to use the cab again ill try what you suggest but i dont thnk i will because ill be using the UL212 for the next gig and if its work ok will be using that 100% with this band.
Maybe it was a combintaion of hollow floor and feet last night. Ill certainly be trying it out at work when everyone has gone home.

Ive heard good things about the Basson cabs but ive not had any experience with them. Nice one.

[bass_ferret]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='19122' date='Jun 17 2007, 12:53 PM']I was wondering if putting rubber feet on the cab made a difference. Have i decoupled the cab from the floor by doing this.[/quote]

Have you seen all the fuss in domestic hi-fi over speaker stands, spikes, isolation feet etc. Its a minefield!

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='bass_ferret' post='19152' date='Jun 17 2007, 02:38 PM']Have you seen all the fuss in domestic hi-fi over speaker stands, spikes, isolation feet etc. Its a minefield![/quote]

I havent been there for ages. Do they still pay £90 for a mains lead over there

Edited June 17, 2007 by dave_bass5

[bass_ferret]

[quote name='obbm' post='19120' date='Jun 17 2007, 12:49 PM']Unfortunately that's the realities of the commercial world. Next you'll be wanting to buy directly for Fender, Gibson, EBMM, Warwick, Ampeg, Ashdown, EBS, Boss, Electro Harmonix, Line 6, etc., etc.

If you could then their overheads would be so great that the prices would go up dramatically to cover the costs and you would save nothing. A small company like Schroeder can probably afford to do it at the moment but once they get larger and have a dealer network it will it will certainly stop.[/quote]

Most manufacturers only have half a dozen customers - the US, European, Asian etc distributors. Therefore they dont need lots of staff to handle the sales that are all big sales.

If you sell direct a small customer base you will need a few more people, maybe an office, so it costs a little more but you cut the retailer and distributor out so you can cope. I dont know how many cabs and amps epifani make a year but its surely in the tens of thousands. If these were all sold direct they would have tens of thousands of direct customers and would need a big office block full of people to do the sales admin, returns, warranties etc. The cost of which gets added to the price of course.