Ou7shined Posted November 22, 2007 Author Share Posted November 22, 2007 Oh no this is about to get complicated that's more votes in favour of 2x4x10. What is this comb filtering you speak of? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machines Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 [url="http://www.moultonlabs.com/index.php/more/about_comb_filtering_phase_shift_and_polarity_reversal/"]http://www.moultonlabs.com/index.php/more/...arity_reversal/[/url] Just read this through - seems feasible. However if it were a real problem that reared it's head all the time - I doubt many people would use a 410 with a 115 at all.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Nimrod Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 [quote name='Machines' post='93146' date='Nov 23 2007, 07:25 AM']However if it were a real problem that reared it's head all the time - I doubt many people would use a 410 with a 115 at all..[/quote] +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernmeister Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 Mmm i'd have to agree with dood on this one & believe me i've experimented. In a nice sterile atmosphere of a rehearsal room the lower frequencies of the 15's would sound nice & give you a fuller sound. But in the complexities of a gig situation especially if a p.a is being used i would definately add another 4 x 10 it will cut thro any mush onstage so that it will be much more audible to your ears, hence the notes will sound more clearer/ definable. The reason added 15" may work for David Nimrod is that his 15" speaker is on top of the 4 x10 which brings it upto his ear level. Hope that this helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-bitch Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 I'm with the 410 brigade too for much the same reasons as provided above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou7shined Posted November 23, 2007 Author Share Posted November 23, 2007 (edited) [quote name='Machines' post='93146' date='Nov 23 2007, 07:25 AM'][url="http://www.moultonlabs.com/index.php/more/about_comb_filtering_phase_shift_and_polarity_reversal/"]<a href="http://www.moultonlabs.com/index.php/more/...arity_reversal/" target="_blank">http://www.moultonlabs.com/index.php/more/...arity_reversal/[/url]</a> Just read this through - seems feasible. However if it were a real problem that reared it's head all the time - I doubt many people would use a 410 with a 115 at all..[/quote] That's an interesting article but after the great explanation on the first page, the second page seems to suggest that although the phenomena exists our brain doesn't really register it unless you're a sound engineer trying really hard to hear it. Also it didn't mention drivers of differing size and how this applies to us. I've also thought of another possible benefit of 2x4x10. Our usual stage order is PA speakers take the outsides, and inside that from stage right to left we have lead guitar amp - drummer (centre)- bass amp - rhythm guitar amp. If I had 2 equal cabs, would placing them either side of the drums work? The idea being to disperse my front of house sound more evenly and also to some extent compensate for the inadequacies of the stage monitors. That said, however unfounded, the idea of adding a 15 still seems to make sense. It's not that my rig is particularly lacking bottom end, but it certainly doesn't produce those lows you feel (but don't necessarily hear) at pro gigs where your organs reorder themselves in your visceral cavity. I'm not really seeking sonic surgery I just want to maximise the frequency range while utilising the full whack my amp can provide. Oh I don't know. I'm still undecided but erring toward the 4x10 again. Edited November 23, 2007 by Ou7shined Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 I've been using 2x10 and 1x15 very successfully for many years without knowing what "....comb filtering" is and I'm afraid I haven't read the link. What kind of music are you playing? 4x10's are punchier but a 1x15 doesn't mean a lack of clarity on stage. What it will do is to give you a fuller, bigger bass sound. Maybe that is important to you? Don't be put off by techno speak. I think you should give your ears a day out and check out these combinations to hear the difference for yourself. ps Sprout curry works everytime....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 +1 for 10's I've mixed 15's and 10's in the past (and it can and does work regardless of the science) however of late I've ralised that the addage that a 15 goes lower is nonsense and a good set of 10's will reproduce the low end as well as any 15. I found that mixing speaker sizes in different cabs means that you may well be compromising your EQ settings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_ferret Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 [quote name='Ou7shined' post='93221' date='Nov 23 2007, 10:44 AM']That said, however unfounded, the idea of adding a 15 still seems to make sense. It's not that my rig is particularly lacking bottom end, but it certainly doesn't produce those lows you feel (but don't necessarily hear) at pro gigs where your organs reorder themselves in your visceral cavity.[/quote] Thats down to the PA - nothing to do with the backline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou7shined Posted November 23, 2007 Author Share Posted November 23, 2007 [quote name='chris_b' post='93229' date='Nov 23 2007, 10:58 AM']I've been using 2x10 and 1x15 very successfully for many years without knowing what "....comb filtering" is and I'm afraid I haven't read the link. What kind of music are you playing? 4x10's are punchier but a 1x15 doesn't mean a lack of clarity on stage. What it will do is to give you a fuller, bigger bass sound. Maybe that is important to you? Don't be put off by techno speak. I think you should give your ears a day out and check out these combinations to hear the difference for yourself. ps Sprout curry works everytime.......[/quote] I'm in a Pearl Jam tribute. I guess you could break it down to just rock (although some of the slower stuff sounds like coun.... no I can't say it.....er.... rural American music to me) I play from ballsy to clicky to fuzzy to fretless (no longer emulated thanks to my latest project ) basically I'm trying to recreate an entire careers worth of sounds. And after 20 years of denial I am coming to terms with the fact that I [b]am[/b] actually a bass player and so have stared venturing into slap - but that's not really important kit wise it's just me piddling about. Mmmmmm sprout curry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou7shined Posted November 23, 2007 Author Share Posted November 23, 2007 [quote name='warwickhunt' post='93241' date='Nov 23 2007, 11:23 AM']+1 for 10's .... I found that mixing speaker sizes in different cabs means that you may well be compromising your EQ settings.[/quote] Good point. This makes far more sense to me than interference patterns etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 Ran 2 4x10's for a decade, either side of the drummer, stereo amped - loverly for stereo modulation fx (I had a stereo tremolo patch that made the drummer look left->right->left->right->left->right->left->right - hysterical!) really broadens your sound, and punters _do_ notice. Down side is up high they lose some connectivity with the stage and hence some bottom end. Plus side is you can get them right against the backwall of the stage then get an amplitude 'bonus' of upto 3dB which can really help. Occasionally I ran 2 1x15's and 2 4x10's with the tops in stereo and the bottoms mono. Huge sound, I never noticed any comb filtering - but then my ears were bleeding and all my internal organs were fighting to be best pals with my sternum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machines Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 Found another compact ABM115 if you're interested Ou7shined [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ashdown-ABM-1X15-Compact-bass-cab_W0QQitemZ270190387661QQihZ017QQcategoryZ58719QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ashdown-ABM-1X15-Com...1QQcmdZViewItem[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou7shined Posted November 23, 2007 Author Share Posted November 23, 2007 [quote name='Machines' post='93441' date='Nov 23 2007, 05:50 PM']Found another compact ABM115 if you're interested Ou7shined [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ashdown-ABM-1X15-Compact-bass-cab_W0QQitemZ270190387661QQihZ017QQcategoryZ58719QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ashdown-ABM-1X15-Com...1QQcmdZViewItem[/url][/quote] Thanks again Machines. I've seen this one come and go 3 times now and he's not dropped the price one iota. I emailed him some cursory question a couple of times too and he never replied. Getting a bad vibe off it. Sorry. I've opened comms on [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270189309186&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=017"]this one[/url] though. I know it's the older of the 2 he's selling but it matches my combo. It all seems kosher enough except he's asking an extra £10 to throw in the original grill :wacko: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou7shined Posted December 6, 2007 Author Share Posted December 6, 2007 Well I bought it. I've posted my first impressions [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=8928&st=0&gopid=100388&#entry100388"]here[/url]. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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