Lending Gear at gigs

[urbanx]

[quote]Gigging should not be stressful.[/quote]

This week has been extremely stressful for me. I didn't get any sleep last night worrying about my rig!

I realise this situation will come up time and time again. And I will be put in the awkward position (again) of "If they can't use your amp, no other bands can play".

It's got to me so much, I have gone out and bought another amp, one which I am willing to lend out. So I can keep my rig for myself, [i]and [/i]provide a combi for anyone that needs to borrow.

Although everyone has assumed the other bands are teenagers, I just don't know if they are or not; I've still not been able to get hold of the 'promotor'.

I guess there's just the principle of the matter that 'musicians' still just turn up to gigs with no instuments, and without any prior contact with the other bands, expect to be kitted out, straps and all.

[bumfrog]

[quote name='urbanx' post='860994' date='Jun 8 2010, 01:59 PM']I realise this situation will come up time and time again. And I will be put in the awkward position (again) of "If they can't use your amp, no other bands can play".[/quote]

regardless of my last post, unless all the other bands were my mates, I'll tell them to f*** off just out of principle if they ever said that to me

[Stylon Pilson]

[quote name='urbanx' post='860994' date='Jun 8 2010, 01:59 PM']It's got to me so much, I have gone out and bought another amp, one which I am willing to lend out. So I can keep my rig for myself, [i]and [/i]provide a combi for anyone that needs to borrow.[/quote]

At risk of ruining another night's sleep for you: what happens if the first band breaks the combo, and the promoter asks to use your rig for the rest of the night? Will you refuse?

S.P.

[D-L-B]

[quote name='urbanx' post='860994' date='Jun 8 2010, 01:59 PM']It's got to me so much, I have gone out and bought another amp, one which I am willing to lend out. So I can keep my rig for myself, [i]and [/i]provide a combi for anyone that needs to borrow.[/quote]
Man, you need to sort yourself out. What the hell are you playing at? Next you'll be buying people basses!
I've gone from sympathising with your situation to thinking you're a fool. It's your gear, it's up to you to decide who you see fit to use it. If you're not comfortable lending it out don't do it. Stress removed!
Your band mates should be backing you up too.
I'd be questioning whether or not I should be playing this gig at all if such undue pressure was placed on me to do somebody else's job.

Edited June 8, 2010 by D-L-B

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='urbanx' post='860994' date='Jun 8 2010, 01:59 PM']I realise this situation will come up time and time again. And I will be put in the awkward position (again) of "If they can't use your amp, no other bands can play".[/quote]

Tell them to call up their local rehearsal room and see if they can loan gear from them. You are not a gear hire company, nor did you tell anyone you were a gear hire company, tell them to get ****ed.

[quote name='urbanx' post='860994' date='Jun 8 2010, 01:59 PM']It's got to me so much, I have gone out and bought another amp, one which I am willing to lend out. So I can keep my rig for myself, [i]and [/i]provide a combi for anyone that needs to borrow.[/quote]

Dude that is wrong, you shouldn't be taking gear specifically for other people.

[HeavyJay]

I understand the practicalities of sharing a backline and I was happy for my amp to be used for it when I started doing those type of gigs where space was at a premium and changeover time was limited.

It was all fine when each band on the bill were happy to contribute a bit and it was all by prior arrangement and everyone respects everyone else's gear. It didn't bother me much when we were headlining and all the others bands used our backline either, we got the decent soundcheck and you know the capability and how to get the best out of your own gear, again by prior arrangement and with the due respect for equipment.

When it bothered me was if all our backline was being used and we weren't headlining, when within our band it was always me bringing my amp as our contribution, and the two occasions where my amp got damaged. That and when there was no prior arrangement for who was bringing what.

I quickly learned which bands / promoters / venues / bandmates didn't live up to my expectations about sensible equipment sharing and developed a good few excuses when they asked:
Sorry, it's being repaired.
Sorry, I've got somewhere to be straight after
Sorry, I'm coming on the bus to this one
Etc.

There is always the possibility that your stuff might get damaged if someone else is using it, regardless of how robust it might be, and even if they seem perfectly knowledgable and sensible when you're explaining the dos and don'ts. If you're not prepared for that, don't lend.

Nowadays I'm in a covers band that doesn't have any supporting acts so it never comes up, when we play festivals we use the house PA and our own backline, the engineers at these things are pretty efficient at quick changeovers as are we so it's not an issue setting up and stripping down in a hurry.

No-one has asked to borrow my stuff for their own gigs, but since we gig pretty often it probably wouldn't be available anyway.

[escholl]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='861008' date='Jun 8 2010, 02:07 PM']Dude that is wrong, you shouldn't be taking gear specifically for other people.[/quote]

+1, as someone else said you are not a gear hire company. I can see why you did it though, but honest you just need to tell them to get stuffed.

[HeavyJay]

[quote name='urbanx' post='860994' date='Jun 8 2010, 01:59 PM']It's got to me so much, I have gone out and bought another amp, one which I am willing to lend out. So I can keep my rig for myself, [i]and [/i]provide a combi for anyone that needs to borrow.[/quote]

I understand that you're under pressure here and that buying a spare amp would just "make it go away" but there is something to be said for standing your ground in these circumstances.

How do these other bands rehearse if they have no equipment?

I know it's easy to say on here "tell them to go forth and multiply" and harder in reality to actually do it but I think you're going above and beyond the call of duty on this one.

You've been stung before, you're clearly uncomfortable about it, so to anyone who is asking, say this:
[b]"the last time I let someone else use my gear it got broken and cost me more than £800 to repair, so the answer is no. Sorry."[/b]

If they question it say this:
[b]"I understand what you're saying but the last time I let someone else use my gear it got broken and cost me more than £800 to repair, so the answer is no. Sorry"[/b]

[algmusic]

[quote name='Stylon Pilson' post='861004' date='Jun 8 2010, 02:05 PM']At risk of ruining another night's sleep for you: what happens if the first band breaks the combo, and the promoter asks to use your rig for the rest of the night? Will you refuse?

S.P.[/quote]


I find it a laugh that someone would bring two amps!!! I wouldn't, Id just say NO to using my gear.. and use as DI box.. If I know them, they can. I'm grateful, i don't get in this situation, but a simple no is .. simple.

On the point of people saying that an amp should be gig proof.. some players.. and I say this loosely, don't know how to treat their/my gear.. so to save me the stress................
[size="7"][/size]
FU*K OFF bring you're own bass!!

[algmusic]

[quote name='HeavyJay' post='861025' date='Jun 8 2010, 02:26 PM']I understand that you're under pressure here and that buying a spare amp would just "make it go away" but there is something to be said for standing your ground in these circumstances.

How do these other bands rehearse if they have no equipment?

I know it's easy to say on here "tell them to go forth and multiply" and harder in reality to actually do it but I think you're going above and beyond the call of duty on this one.

You've been stung before, you're clearly uncomfortable about it, so to anyone who is asking, say this:
[b]"the last time I let someone else use my gear it got broken and cost me more than £800 to repair, so the answer is no. Sorry."[/b]

If they question it say this:
[b]"I understand what you're saying but the last time I let someone else use my gear it got broken and cost me more than £800 to repair, so the answer is no. Sorry"[/b][/quote]

[size=7]Preach it mr bass player... [/size]

[clauster]

I've only got a cheap amp, an Ashdown EB180-12. It's fine for rehearsals and the little venues I play with the originals band (the covers band I always DI through the singer's PA).


I'd be willing to lend it if asked nicely, but no-one ever has. More often than not, someone else on the bill will see what I've got and offer to let me use their rig instead

[Colledge]

i think that if i was in your position, i would take my rig, set it up, gather all of the other bassists up and say in a calm and relaxed voice, "f*** around with my gear and i'll f*** around with your face," make them scared of you.

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='clauster' post='861047' date='Jun 8 2010, 02:38 PM']I'd be willing to lend it if asked nicely, but no-one ever has. More often than not, someone else on the bill will see what I've got and offer to let me use their rig instead [/quote]

I sometimes get this when I turn up with my little Schroeder cab, often a charitable bassist will offer the use of his 410 but I always decline because I much prefer the sound of my Schroeder for backline. Last gig we played all the other bands were using an Ashdown 810, I put my wee Schroeder infront of it for our set which made it look even smaller.

One plus is that it suggests to all the bands and gig-goers around here that I must have an impossibly large penis.

[ahpook]

[quote name='dangerboy' post='860889' date='Jun 8 2010, 12:34 PM']I think if the answer is that you're in a scene where lending is abused, don't lend. But if you're in a scene where lending is expected and respected, do it.[/quote]

pretty well summed up db...when it comes down to it, you do as you wish. it's your stuff to do with as you please.

tho it seems this thread's gone a bit beyond that truism, so i reckon we can add it to the plectrum/no plectrum, slapping/not slapping and jaco praise/bashing pot boilers that crop up now and again.

[Doddy]

[quote name='urbanx' post='860994' date='Jun 8 2010, 01:59 PM']It's got to me so much, I have gone out and bought another amp, one which I am willing to lend out. So I can keep my rig for myself, [i]and [/i]provide a combi for anyone that needs to borrow.[/quote]

I think this is too much to be honest. It's not your place to buy another amp for other bands to use.
If you are going to use your rig and let everyone else use the combo,it means you are carrying more
gear than necessary. If you are willing to take two rigs to a gig,be prepared for every other band to
take advantage of you. Why should they buy/bring an amp when they know that you will bring one for
especially for them?

[Bison]

I never let anybody use my gear, but then again I don't borrow anybody's either, unless it's provided as backline of course.

[chris_b]

Why do you "sharers" allow the promoter to get away with pressurising you into 7 min changeover's? You need at least 10 mins to get the previous band off and 20 mins to get the next band on. It's not a race! I don't understand why 30 min changeover's should cause a problem.

Edited June 8, 2010 by chris_b

[bumfrog]

[quote name='chris_b' post='861079' date='Jun 8 2010, 03:15 PM']Why do you "sharers" allow the promoter to get away with pressurising you into 7 min changeover's? You need at least 10 mins to get the previous band off and 20 mins to get the next band on. It's not a race! I don't understand why 30 min changeover's should cause a problem.[/quote]

depends where you are.

If you live in a place where's there's only a handful of venues, they may take umbridge and you won't get to play there again. Then one is up the proverbial if that happens!

It would be nice if the bands called the shots, but a lot of the time the venues and promoters know full well that if one band starts being arsey they can be replaced by another 3 who will take their place and not be arsey.

[throwoff]

This has reminded me of a funny little gigging story.

Guitarist in my band bought a Marshall Half Stack (TSL 60 head and Cab) and for the first gig we were using it (all day outdoor affair) he let a friend of ours use it with his band even though they were playing first because he was considering buying one/was a very close friend/very knowledgable gigging musician who knew how to care for gear.

Anyway soundcheck went cool they go on as first band and the amp is feeding back constantly (guitarist using a tele with singles up loud on a small stage!). In the end my brother runs on stage turns the presence right down (it had been knocked at some point it seems between check and gig not altered by the guitarist) and everything is fine and dandy.

Just after they finish the last song myself and my guitarist are accosted by the 'band manager' AKA the drummer and singers dad and threatened with violence for breaking the amp to make their sound bad.....

Logic just doesn't appear in some peoples minds!
We broke our amp which was a week old and cost over a grand BEFORE we needed to use it for our set to make a good friend's guitar sound bad... riiight.

From then on we NEVER lent anything to anyone even friends.

Edited June 8, 2010 by throwoff

[51m0n]

Why do you need more than 10 minutes for a changeover of gear??

I've been in bands on the original circuit and we could change the entire two bands' gear out (inc drums) and line check within ten minutes.

You have to know what you are about, you have to be prepared to do it, you need a decent sound guy.

It can certainly be done, 10 minutes is a long time, you do also need somewhere to ferry the other gear to off stage, sinice this is stage one though, you can leave band a to pack down that kit whilst band b is doing their line check.

I've never been to a gig where the audiemce went home because the next band took 15 minutes to start....

[D-L-B]

[quote]If you live in a place where's there's only a handful of venues, they may take umbridge and you won't get to play there again. Then one is up the proverbial if that happens!

It would be nice if the bands called the shots, but a lot of the time the venues and promoters know full well that if one band starts being arsey they can be replaced by another 3 who will take their place and not be arsey.[/quote]
Create a bit of solidarity. Organise your own gigs. Why do you need to play these crap gigs so badly anyway?

Edited June 8, 2010 by D-L-B

[Ian Savage]

[quote name='51m0n' post='861086' date='Jun 8 2010, 03:23 PM']I've never been to a gig where the audiemce went home because the next band took 15 minutes to start....[/quote]

I find about fifteen minutes is the perfect amount of time to top up on nicotine and alcohol between bands...

[OldGit]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='861053' date='Jun 8 2010, 02:44 PM']One plus is that it suggests to all the bands and gig-goers around here that I must have an impossibly large mid hump.[/quote]

Fixed

[bumfrog]

[quote name='D-L-B' post='861089' date='Jun 8 2010, 03:23 PM']Create a bit of solidarity. Organise your own gigs. Why do you need to play these crap gigs so badly anyway?[/quote]

like I say, depends where you live. In some places the only venues are run like that, so you don't have much chance.

Plus it also depends on how much a venue is charging to hire out. If it's expensive, you may not make the money back on the door, thus it's costing you to play. Not the best scenario to be in.

not saying it's right mind you, it's just the way it is.

As for solidarity and organising things. Cmon, we're all in/have been in bands. We should all know how hard it is to organise a bunch of musicians to do anything at the best of times, hell it's easier to work with kids and animals

Edited June 8, 2010 by bumfrog

[D-L-B]

[quote name='bumfrog' post='861105' date='Jun 8 2010, 03:33 PM']Plus it also depends on how much a venue is charging to hire out. If it's expensive, you may not make the money back on the door, thus it's costing you to play. Not the best scenario to be in.[/quote]
By removing the 'promoter' and running an equivalent event yourself this shouldn't be an issue.