NJE Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 Hey all, Just after a bit of advice and some opinions with regards to these tunes. I have just joined a 8 piece soul/funk/disco band and am in the process of learning all of the tunes. I have been given a few tunes to get started on and although making progress with the actual notes I am having some issues with getting the sound. The following tracks seem to have very stoccato, burpy, dead sounding bass tones and I was wondering if it was the way the bass was recorded or technique or am I in fact listening to basses with flatwounds on? Having never had experience of flats I am wondering if getting some would help me get the sound? My jazz sounds too zingy and bright for some of these tunes despite some EQ fiddling. Songs: Aint no stopping us now Le Freak Boogie Wonderland Lost in Music You to me are everything Disco Inferno You should be dancing Any Ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 Dont think any of those bassists used flats on those recordings..roll off the tone on your jazz..is it a fender...The Mc Fadden and White head tune sounds like its played on a P Bass..so does the Bee Gees track... That tone for a jazz, i would roll off the bridge and roll down the tone... Hey NJE i didnt realise you were a cheltenham man...me too!! Hey do you play a Overwater at the moment...what band have you played for recently? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJE Posted June 23, 2010 Author Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='bubinga5' post='875388' date='Jun 23 2010, 01:40 PM']Dont think any of those bassists used flats on those recordings..roll off the tone on your jazz..is it a fender...The Mc Fadden and White head tune sounds like its played on a P Bass..so does the Bee Gees track... That tone for a jazz, i would roll off the bridge and roll down the tone... Hey NJE i didnt realise you were a cheltenham man...me too!! Hey do you play a Overwater at the moment...what band have you played for recently?[/quote] Yeah been in Cheltenham for about 2 years now, great place with a good local music shop too which was a bonus when I moved up. Anyway yes I have a Overwater Jazz at the moment but used to have a Progress 3, and I was/am playing with a local band called the Fennel Sitaution, its good fun and they are nice guys but I have now just joined this soul/disco type band which hopefully will gig a bit more and potentially make some cash. Anyway back on topic... I was wondering whether a few of the tunes were P basses and the dead-ish sound was more down to the recording quality and my ears. Plus I know Bernard Edwards used to use a Stingray so dont knwo what I was thinking putting the Chic tune down. I think perhaps I need to experiment a bit more. I tried panning off the bridge pickup and it does help but it still sounds too vibrant, maybe its the new strings and the bass is very bright sounding, considderably more than my old Progress. Might also just be a case of more practice and a technique adjustment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 Aha i knew it was you..i saw you on youtube with the Progress and put 2 and 2 together....im erm.... Andrew that played with The Fennel briefly before...Pete and CO (may) have mentioned me...i saw you play at the Frog... Anyways i was thinking you had a Fender jazz, with my recommended tone adjustments....I take it the OW Jazz is active..if so, do you know what pre is in it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJE Posted June 23, 2010 Author Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='bubinga5' post='875462' date='Jun 23 2010, 02:41 PM']Aha i knew it was you..i saw you on youtube with the Progress and put 2 and 2 together....im erm.... Andrew that played with The Fennel briefly before...Pete and CO (may) have mentioned me...i saw you play at the Frog... Anyways i was thinking you had a Fender jazz, with my recommended tone adjustments....I take it the OW Jazz is active..if so, do you know what pre is in it?[/quote] Aha your Andrew, I too saw you on youtube playing with them, ha ha small world. They have been through so many members! I saw a video or picture with you and a bass i did not recognise, if it had been your rather nice Sei I would have made the link straight away, not many of those in Cheltenham. The Overwater has a John East BTB-01 stacked bass/treble control with Vol/Bal. Its a good unit but I am thinking about having it changed for some more flexibility, maybe the full U-Retro Deluxe with active 'tone' control. That might give me a few more classic tones as well as the super modern. Dont you have a East Pre in your Sei? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 Definitely not flats. Looks like you just have to be really [i]relaxed[/i]. And you probably don't need Slash to do the guitar solo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='NJE' post='875480' date='Jun 23 2010, 02:55 PM']Aha your Andrew, I too saw you on youtube playing with them, ha ha small world. They have been through so many members! I saw a video or picture with you and a bass i did not recognise, if it had been your rather nice Sei I would have made the link straight away, not many of those in Cheltenham. The Overwater has a John East BTB-01 stacked bass/treble control with Vol/Bal. Its a good unit but I am thinking about having it changed for some more flexibility, maybe the full U-Retro Deluxe with active 'tone' control. That might give me a few more classic tones as well as the super modern. Dont you have a East Pre in your Sei?[/quote]Yeah small world bro.. Im not familiar with the BTB pre..but yeah the U Retro is a very comprehensive preamp...it is truely awsome in the Sei..to be honest it takes a bit of getting used to, and adjusting wise it should be used very sensitively..but when you know it, its very effective.. have you considered the Audere JZ3? excuse the playing in those vids, i was really ill and was a little reserved for me...this was the bass anyway...an Ostinato 4 custom...the Progress sounded killer BTW.. [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=34582"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=34582[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='discreet' post='875490' date='Jun 23 2010, 03:11 PM']Definitely not flats. Looks like you just have to be really [i]relaxed[/i]. And you probably don't need Slash to do the guitar solo. [/quote] great great tune but is it me or is it every time i see a vid of Chic live it seems a little false and commercialized? whats up with the dancers..GO AWAY!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='bubinga5' post='875502' date='Jun 23 2010, 03:28 PM']great great tune but is it me or is it every time i see a vid of Chic live it seems a little false and commercialized? whats up with the dancers..GO AWAY!![/quote] Well, it was a hit in 1978... ennui has probably set in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RhysP Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 I would think most of them would have been wearing heels of some sort, definitely not flats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='discreet' post='875490' date='Jun 23 2010, 03:11 PM']Definitely not flats. Looks like you just have to be really [i]relaxed[/i]. And you probably don't need Slash to do the guitar solo.[/quote] Well named, mate. You just slashed all over the great bass doody build up bit ... All those tunes sound roundwound to me. Take the bright out and use a lot of finger muting to seperate the notes. Alternativley a foam mute under the strings will probably do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 A lot of Chic's stuff was a '76 Stingray armed with flats. I don't know about those two particular songs. The dead sound could also be the result of a foam mute(s), or good technique. I find it's always easier to get a dead tone from flats than the other techniques though. Contrary to what a lot of people assume, there's a big difference in tone between a bass strung with rounds with the tone rolled off and the same bass strung with flats. There's also a lot of difference in tone between different makes of flats. Boring post eh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 Oh, and if you've never used flats, you owe it to yourself to try them out. You'll probably pick up a used set on here from free if you ask around C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Beedster' post='875645' date='Jun 23 2010, 05:45 PM']A lot of Chic's stuff was a '76 Stingray armed with flats. I don't know about those two particular songs. The dead sound could also be the result of a foam mute(s), or good technique. I find it's always easier to get a dead tone from flats than the other techniques though. Contrary to what a lot of people assume, there's a big difference in tone between a bass strung with rounds with the tone rolled off and the same bass strung with flats. There's also a lot of difference in tone between different makes of flats. Boring post eh [/quote]Not at all Chris...i learned something...ive used La Bella Deep Talker's and loved them...but i still want the zing from round wound's because i slap from song to song...my guess is the audience doesnt know the difference between my jazz with flats on or my jazz with rounds on with the tone off though. chris have you ever tried Cocco's of any kind?..Cocco was the president of Labella at one time. Edited June 23, 2010 by bubinga5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 After trying a stingray with flats i can state that in my opinion, Bernard used Flats with his ray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 (edited) [quote name='NJE' post='875342' date='Jun 23 2010, 01:15 PM']....I have been given a few tunes to get started on and although making progress with the actual notes I am having some issues with getting the sound....[/quote] You're definitely listening to Jazz, Precision and Stingray basses (maybe others), strung with flats and rounds, using mutes and not using mutes and EQ'ed to pieces in the studio! You shouldn't be aiming to change your sound for every song! Just get yourself a great live tone, probably with the emphasis on the mids and low mids, and concentrate on the way you play more than the sound. Edited June 23, 2010 by chris_b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
risingson Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='Shockwave' post='875653' date='Jun 23 2010, 05:51 PM']After trying a stingray with flats i can state that in my opinion, Bernard used Flats with his ray.[/quote] As far as I'm aware, Bernard Edwards rarely changed his strings on both his Precision and Stingrays but all of which were strung with roundwound strings, never flats. P-bass/old roundwounds = Good Times tone... not a Stingray as commonly believed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tino Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='NJE' post='875342' date='Jun 23 2010, 01:15 PM']Hey all, Just after a bit of advice and some opinions with regards to these tunes. I have just joined a 8 piece soul/funk/disco band and am in the process of learning all of the tunes. I have been given a few tunes to get started on and although making progress with the actual notes I am having some issues with getting the sound. The following tracks seem to have very stoccato, burpy, dead sounding bass tones and I was wondering if it was the way the bass was recorded or technique or am I in fact listening to basses with flatwounds on? Having never had experience of flats I am wondering if getting some would help me get the sound? My jazz sounds too zingy and bright for some of these tunes despite some EQ fiddling. Songs: Aint no stopping us now Le Freak Boogie Wonderland Lost in Music You to me are everything Disco Inferno You should be dancing Any Ideas?[/quote] DEFO NO They were all wearing HEELS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='chris_b' post='875692' date='Jun 23 2010, 06:25 PM']You're definitely listening to Jazz, Precision and Stingray basses (maybe others), strung with flats and rounds, using mutes and not using mutes and EQ'ed to pieces in the studio! You shouldn't be aiming to change your sound for every song! Just get yourself a great live tone, probably with the emphasis on the mids and low mids, and concentrate on the way you play more than the sound.[/quote] +1 It has to work with your band, your line up and your gear in your gig environment and for the audience that's there. Sure change eq and stuff on teh fly but trying to get the exact sound on the record is (IMHO) a fruitless task. I'll trade "I can hear it well" for "it sounds just like the record" any time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crez5150 Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 (edited) Bernard (Chic) was once asked what strings he used.... 'I dunno.... what comes fitted on a Stingray' was the answer.... or there abouts. He never changed them. Edited June 23, 2010 by crez5150 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorbass Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 (edited) Disco Inferno bassman is Ronnie Baker who was most definitely a flats user. He always went for the thickest, fattest bass sound he could get - flats, foam mutes, gaffer tape over the strings at the bridge, the works. A true BASS man! He was also a producer and apparently a real tough guy to work for. Edited June 23, 2010 by doctorbass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 [quote name='doctorbass' post='875921' date='Jun 23 2010, 10:24 PM']Disco Inferno bassman is Ronnie Baker who was most definitely a flats user. He always went for the thickest, fattest bass sound he could get - flats, foam mutes, gaffer tape over the strings at the bridge, the works. A true BASS man! He was also a producer and apparently a real tough guy to work for.[/quote] I read somewhere that Ronnie Baker also put butter on the old flats on his Precision bass for yet more fatness. I haven't listened to it in a while but doesn't Disco Inferno have a clavinet or something doubling the bassline? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 (edited) I gotta get me some of those [i]threads[/i]. Edited June 23, 2010 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJE Posted June 24, 2010 Author Share Posted June 24, 2010 Thanks for all of the posts, loads to think about. I think the first thing I am going to do is try some flats on my backup bass. The songs might not have been played on flats but I have never tried them before so as Beedster said I feel I owe it to myself to try some. If it does go some way to re-creating the sound then that is a bonus. I also think I will be less concerned about nailing the exact tone and as OldGit and chris_b say, find something that can be well heard and works in the band and just get a good overall approximation. Cheers for the suggestions chaps, just need to have a look around for a good 5 string set of Flats now, where did that search button go.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonic_Groove Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 [quote name='RhysP' post='875578' date='Jun 23 2010, 05:06 PM']I would think most of them would have been wearing heels of some sort, definitely not flats.[/quote] Classic lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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