Don't laugh

[thisnameistaken]

I'm currently practicing some walking stuff, I wondered if anyone knows of some recordings of standards that are in the original key so I can look them up on Spotify and follow along with them using the Real Book charts. Bloody horn soloists can't leave the key alone it seems and I'm struggling to find recordings in the right key and would rather not spend half my time transposing when I could be playing.

Thanks!

[TPJ]

Have you thought about getting some Abersol books and CD's? A good tool for learning.

[thisnameistaken]

I hadn't, but will look. Didn't know where to look really.

[dougal]

Amazon & Musicroom.com both stock them.

[url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=jamey+aebersold&tag=googhydr-21&index=aps&hvadid=5927849089&ref=pd_sl_2rxbcupc3h_b"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/?ie=UTF8&key...sl_2rxbcupc3h_b[/url]

[url="http://www.musicroom.com/Search/Find.aspx?searchtext=aebersold"]http://www.musicroom.com/Search/Find.aspx?...htext=aebersold[/url]

[thisnameistaken]

Am I going to find these tough going? Reading dots is a struggle for me.

I know I should be learning to read anyway but when I tried that years ago I never had a single occasion where anyone required me to read anything, so the only time I was using that skill was when I was at home learning it. Seemed a waste of time, ultimately.

But I suppose the main reason I'm learning double bass is so I can continue to get interesting gigs in my 40s when I'm too old for the gigs I'm doing now. So learning to read might be handy by then.

Hmm.

[TPJ]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='876444' date='Jun 24 2010, 02:20 PM']Am I going to find these tough going? Reading dots is a struggle for me.

I know I should be learning to read anyway but when I tried that years ago I never had a single occasion where anyone required me to read anything, so the only time I was using that skill was when I was at home learning it. Seemed a waste of time, ultimately.

But I suppose the main reason I'm learning double bass is so I can continue to get interesting gigs in my 40s when I'm too old for the gigs I'm doing now. So learning to read might be handy by then.

Hmm.[/quote]

Well, the dots help to learn the melodies, but the cd's are also great to play along to and to work on improv.
You can learn the tunes by ear and then play along

[Mike]

plus it has the changes, just like the real book.

For spotify, I find Chet Baker often plays the standards in original keys.

[Faithless]

Get hold of Ed Friedland's - 'Creating Walking Basslines". Or PM me

I doubt, if you will learn good walking just by rushing through standards - there's a bit of basics to learn, and it will become a lot easier 'to walk' in the future..

What you first need to do, is learn 12-bar blues (jazzy one, I mean..), and Rhythm Changes.. It is a [i]must[/i], a law.

That book provides those progressions, and gives a helluva lot advices, how to walk.

Just don't forget to learn every exercise in all keys (Ed suggests to learn only in a few, most popular keys, bad habit..), and, believe me, you'll get that walking thing, mate

Edited June 25, 2010 by Faithless

[jakenewmanbass]

Bwahhahahahahahahahahahahahah

I'm sorry, i couldn't resist it and i know you're man enough to take it....

I would recommend anything by the Oscar Peterson trio with Ray Brown and Ed Thigpen, great lines, amazing feel and no horns in the way so the bass plays a strong role.
And it's just awesome....
Welcome to real music.

*drops pin and ducks*

[jakenewmanbass]

To add another little contrary note to the advice thus far. Music is an aural medium so [b]listen first[/b]. Let the books consolidate what is flowing through your ears.

[BigBeatNut]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='875784' date='Jun 23 2010, 07:49 PM']Bloody horn soloists can't leave the key alone it seems and I'm struggling to find recordings in the right key and would rather not spend half my time transposing when I could be playing.[/quote]
Perhaps slightly less applicable to DB than it is to BG, but ... a Korg Pandora will transpose the stuff you're playing along with into any key. My Pandora PX4B does it, and I'm pretty sure the PX4D and the '5' model must do it too. I think the '4's are now very reasonably priced on eBay.

But if you can easily find what you want on spotify as per other recommendations, no need.

Andy

[Bilbo]

A great source of several standards in the keys in which they appear in real books are the Miles Davis cds 'workin', steamin', 'relaxin' and 'cookin'. Paul Chambers is a very stable bassist (he had lessons with Ray Brown, Jake) and doesn't break it up veryu much so his lines are generally very logical and easy to follow. Three of them are here for less than £5

[url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Workin-Relaxin-Steamin-Miles-Davis/dp/B001F4YTMA/ref=pd_rhf_shvl_2"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Workin-Relaxin-Ste...f=pd_rhf_shvl_2[/url]

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='Faithless' post='877317' date='Jun 25 2010, 12:42 PM']Get hold of Ed Friedland's - 'Creating Walking Basslines". Or PM me

I doubt, if you will learn good walking just by rushing through standards - there's a bit of basics to learn, and it will become a lot easier 'to walk' in the future..[/quote]

That's good advice but I've been playing bass for a long time and I have a good idea of the kind of skills I am missing. What I need - most of all - is plenty of practice material with changes that are more challenging than the modern pop music I usually get to play. So I can learn my way around and develop more freedom on the instrument. It's not just about wanting to "play jazz", I'm trying to break out of some bad habits and broaden my knowledge too.

[quote name='jakesbass' post='877353' date='Jun 25 2010, 01:22 PM']To add another little contrary note to the advice thus far. Music is an aural medium so [b]listen first[/b]. Let the books consolidate what is flowing through your ears.[/quote]

That's all well and good but a lot of the harmony in jazz is really alien to me, my ears can't tell what it is half the time. I'm alright with cycling fourths and fifths and simple stuff like that because you get that in pop music but I struggle with anything beyond that. I've also noticed I'm especially bad at recognising chords that don't have the root note in the bass (having struggled to work out some Beach Boys tunes from recordings recently). This is one of the skills I'm trying to improve.

[jakenewmanbass]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='877701' date='Jun 25 2010, 07:43 PM']That's all well and good but a lot of the harmony in jazz is really alien to me, my ears can't tell what it is half the time. I'm alright with cycling fourths and fifths and simple stuff like that because you get that in pop music but I struggle with anything beyond that. I've also noticed I'm especially bad at recognising chords that don't have the root note in the bass (having struggled to work out some Beach Boys tunes from recordings recently). This is one of the skills I'm trying to improve.[/quote]
And it's exactly because it's alien to you that you should listen to it, ask any language student and they will tell you that nothing compares to immersing yourself in the language you're trying to learn... by listening to it all day everyday, living in the country.
Jazz is no different mate

[thisnameistaken]

Sorry I wasn't flatly refusing to listen to jazz, I just need to read it too. When the chords are going by two to the bar it's just one long WTF to me, even if I've got them written infront of me...

Too long spent playing reggae I reckon.

Edited June 25, 2010 by thisnameistaken

[jakenewmanbass]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='877751' date='Jun 25 2010, 08:37 PM']Sorry I wasn't flatly refusing to listen to jazz, I just need to read it too. When the chords are going by two to the bar it's just one long WTF to me, even if I've got them written infront of me...

Too long spent playing reggae I reckon.[/quote]
understood.... chords will help no doubt, I was just adding it in at that point because all the advice up to that point had been 'get this or that book'
I teach bass (as you probably know) and have had the dubious pleasure of getting hundreds of undergrads to learn to walk, so I will repeat for the sake of sticking to my guns, aural immersion is the key... slowly, your ears will adjust... I promise

[thisnameistaken]

I'll give it a go. I need to do something because I'm struggling to even keep time with a lot of this bop stuff at the moment let alone follow the changes. I love the sound but I can't help wondering how much coke they had to put away to play it.

[OutToPlayJazz]

I really need to write that book of Jazz standard bass lines this summer - I keep threatening to do it, but I really need to get it done!

If you need any charts and suggested recordings, just let me know. Most of mine are just chorded, so not heavy on the reading side.

On the "laugh" side of things though - Jake, what the hell is that on your head?! I thought we pro bass players didn't do hair?

Edited June 25, 2010 by OutToPlayJazz

[jakenewmanbass]

[quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='877797' date='Jun 25 2010, 09:43 PM']On the "laugh" side of things though - Jake, what the hell is that on your head?! I thought we pro bass players didn't do hair? [/quote]
It's a pair of cans Rich, I lifted them up to give the band yet another set of very detailed instructions And someone snapped me. We were in the studio doing a live recording for Spotify which will be available soon with streaming video (yep they filmed us too) It's 100% live no O'dubs or editing and I'm singing BVs too.

PS like the sound of the book.

Edited June 25, 2010 by jakesbass

[macclad]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='877761' date='Jun 25 2010, 08:58 PM']I'll give it a go. I need to do something because I'm struggling to even keep time with a lot of this bop stuff at the moment let alone follow the changes. I love the sound but I can't help wondering how much coke they had to put away to play it.[/quote]
Having read all your earlier posts and queries etc it strikes me i am in exactly the same bass boat as you right now!,im glad im not alone in this ! keep trying man ,thats what im doin ,i may get a few lessons for technique and improvisation,that will help me i think ,good luck!!

[Bilbo]

The biggest problem with playing bebop is not in playing that fast but in THINKING that fast. It takes practice, nothing more and nothing less

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='Bilbo' post='880866' date='Jun 29 2010, 12:40 PM']The biggest problem with playing bebop is not in playing that fast but in THINKING that fast.[/quote]

Yeah that's exactly the impression I got.

[quote name='Bilbo' post='880866' date='Jun 29 2010, 12:40 PM']It takes practice, nothing more and nothing less[/quote]

Well I'm working through some practice material now - thanks everybody - and wow what a lot I have to learn. Last night I really got a good overview of how much I don't know and it was pretty terrifying!

[Bilbo]

That's the wonder of it. You never stop learning. The further you get in understanding the stuff, the further away the horizon gets. The secret is not to try to learn it all but to learn what you need to be you.

[mtroun]

Noone seems to have made the obvious suggestion: go to a teacher who specialises in jazz and get them to recommend a good starting point. I don't think trying to play bebop is the best starting point as far as walking lines go.
When I finally met the right teacher (after two years self-taught jazz bass) he basically took me back to the start and got me playing very simple walking lines over blues progressions and other simple forms, of course I wanted to play very complex material straight away but having those basic principles down pat is the key to expanding beyond them imo.

Recommended listening: Walter Page with Count Basie, Paul Chambers and Ron Carter with Miles Davis, Ray Brown with Oscar Peterson of course, as much jazz as you can get hold of. There's so much you can learn from everything that's ever been recorded, but start with something simple!