Mark Percy Posted July 23, 2010 Posted July 23, 2010 when deciding to replace, or build a new driver combination, when using 400 watt tube heads, it is important to note that new power piston high wattage drivers are wholly unsuitable, and require vast wattage headroom to get them moving. and are insensitive and unmusical. in a 2x15 for example, two eminence CB158 are just right. in an 8x10 the eminence B810 10" are highly musical. or the B102 10" in a 4x10. celestion do fantastic bass guitar speakers, in thier orange or green range. and so do fane. the idea is to get the cones moving on this type of tube amp wattages. marshall use eminence in the bass 8x10. to avoid disappointment, realise that wattages are not synchronised to performance. a 101db low wattage driver, at only 150watts, will move a lot of articulate bass. valve watts different to transistor watts. the envelope is different, and sounds much bigger. in the old days a whole collection of 100watt heads, and 4x12's sounded very big indeed and was pushing a lot of sound out. so the relationship held true, 100watt 4x12's were getting going on the tube heads. the guitarists know this to be true. obviously a bassplayer wants a 400watt head and two cabs for clean headroom, but not the disappointment of 2000watt cabs, on a low output 400watt tube head, as opposed to an 800watt cab responding well, or two 250watt cabs, seriously moving to a 400watt tube head, that's not really clipping. nowdays watts is cheap. so the DJ's demanded power pistons. DJ's that are in the know, now have gone back to old turbosound cabs, as they are so very musical. and without heavy cones like modern P.D's and even old cambridge audio slaves, with huge power supplies, but that is another matter for another day, the subject of transfomers. cheers, mark.
escholl Posted July 23, 2010 Posted July 23, 2010 [quote name='Mark Percy' post='903463' date='Jul 23 2010, 06:31 PM']valve watts different to transistor watts.[/quote] Nope. Also, what on earth are you on about? There are plenty of drivers out there that match high sensitivity with high power handling. Cab efficiency in the low end has as much, if not more, to do with the size and construction of the cab as it has to do with the driver. Bassists 40 years ago got away with 100 watt amps because the cabs were BIG and the tone they were after wasn't the clean, deep tone that a lot of bassists want these days. Guitarists can still get away with it because they're not after much below about 100Hz, same reason they can use open-backed designs, they just don't need the lows. Clean low frequencies can take a lot of power, even in a fairly efficient box, hence the modern trend of amps with silly amounts of power, to power these little tiny modern cabs and still produce deep bass. Also, I'm not sure what you're trying to say about cabs that have a much greater power handling than the amp? This never has been, and never will be, an issue. My amp puts out 250 watts, my cabs can take 650W at least -- I nor anyone else would not be better off by more closely matching the amp and cab power, that's not how it works. I'm sure you're just trying to be helpful, so I'm not trying to have a go at you, honest, but there's enough confusion over all this stuff already.
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted July 23, 2010 Posted July 23, 2010 [quote name='Mark Percy' post='903463' date='Jul 23 2010, 01:31 PM']new power piston high wattage drivers are wholly unsuitable, and require vast wattage headroom to get them moving. and are insensitive and unmusical.[/quote] Totally unequivocally untrue, as is the rest of your post. Nothing said has any basis in engineering fact, I'm afraid.
Gwilym Posted July 23, 2010 Posted July 23, 2010 [quote name='escholl' post='903516' date='Jul 23 2010, 07:30 PM']Also, what on earth are you on about?[/quote] +11
Mr. Foxen Posted July 23, 2010 Posted July 23, 2010 I have no idea why someone would bother typing all this. Little bits come out in discussion when someone is trying to be helpful, usually in the form of explaining a known phenomena using incorrect reasoning, but compiling a huge amount of wrong into a single essay is weird.
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted July 23, 2010 Posted July 23, 2010 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='903695' date='Jul 23 2010, 07:46 PM']compiling a huge amount of wrong into a single essay is weird.[/quote]Clearly you are unfamiliar with Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh and Sarah Palin, who have made doing just so into a very comfortable living.
Mr. Foxen Posted July 24, 2010 Posted July 24, 2010 [quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' post='903698' date='Jul 24 2010, 12:51 AM']Clearly you are unfamiliar with Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh and Sarah Palin, who have made doing just so into a very comfortable living. [/quote] Not the ideal examples since this is primarily a UK forum, but point taken. People really need to quote some sources when stating 'facts', yourself included, although I fully foresee that the sources would often be your own writings or knowledge, since it derives from experimentation and experience you have first hand.
escholl Posted July 24, 2010 Posted July 24, 2010 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='903701' date='Jul 24 2010, 01:05 AM']People really need to quote some sources when stating 'facts'[/quote] I like this rule. I think I may start trying to do this, as much as is feasible.
LawrenceH Posted July 24, 2010 Posted July 24, 2010 [quote name='escholl' post='904060' date='Jul 24 2010, 03:10 PM']I like this rule. I think I may start trying to do this, as much as is feasible.[/quote] Welcome to the world of science! If you're used to writing scientific articles it's pretty shocking when you realise the basis of how journos put articles together.
Mr. Foxen Posted July 24, 2010 Posted July 24, 2010 [quote name='LawrenceH' post='904165' date='Jul 24 2010, 05:24 PM']Welcome to the world of science! If you're used to writing scientific articles it's pretty shocking when you realise the basis of how journos put articles together.[/quote] I got into the habit from studying Law. Guess it is 'academia' really.
escholl Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 [quote name='LawrenceH' post='904165' date='Jul 24 2010, 05:24 PM']Welcome to the world of science! If you're used to writing scientific articles it's pretty shocking when you realise the basis of how journos put articles together.[/quote] lol, cheers, but I'm already there mate, for a long time now. And yes, it is shocking. I just never really thought of doing it for forum posts.
BassBod Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 I will directly quote my three year old son..."what say??" Nuff already
CraigPlaysBass Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 Who is this guy? Because he's starting to be annoying...
dannybuoy Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 (edited) Come on Mark, this is Bass[b]Chat[/b], not BassMakeControversialPostsThenNotRevisitTheThreadToDiscussThingsFurther.co.uk! Your website [url="http://www.markpercy.co.uk"]www.markpercy.co.uk[/url] sure is an interesting read, it's like a lucky dip collection of bass stuff, art, religion and randomness. I didn't know the actor who played Jesus in Passion Of The Christ got struck by lightning twice on set, this has nudged me one notch further away from atheism on the agnosticity scale! Edited July 25, 2010 by dannybuoy
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 [quote name='dannybuoy' post='904778' date='Jul 25 2010, 10:03 AM']I didn't know the actor who played Jesus in Passion Of The Christ got struck by lightning twice on set[/quote]I'm wondering what he did to so piss off God, and why God's aim is so poor to have missed him twice!
MoonBassAlpha Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 [quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' post='904817' date='Jul 25 2010, 03:55 PM']I'm wondering what he did to so piss off God, and why God's aim is so poor to have missed him twice![/quote] Maybe it's like your "3 strikes and you're out" law....
Colledge Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 [quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' post='904817' date='Jul 25 2010, 03:55 PM']I'm wondering what he did to so piss off God, and why God's aim is so poor to have missed him twice![/quote] "god works in mysterious ways" - the answer to everything
Mr. Foxen Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 [quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' post='904817' date='Jul 25 2010, 03:55 PM']I'm wondering what he did to so piss off God, and why God's aim is so poor to have missed him twice![/quote] People used to be able to take a hint.
Muzz Posted July 25, 2010 Posted July 25, 2010 Jim Caviezel wasn't struck twice by lightning. He was struck once with an AD while sheltering under an umbrella. The AD was also struck month earlier. So, not even that bit's accurate... Why am I not surprised?
TimR Posted July 31, 2010 Posted July 31, 2010 (edited) I have personally met Mark on a number of occasions in an unrelated field. I didn't know he was a member of this forum. Next time I see him I'll talk to him about it. If anyone wants to PM me I can probably answer a few questions. Edited July 31, 2010 by TimR
Dood Posted August 1, 2010 Posted August 1, 2010 I'll lock this post and let it die I think. It's not really serving any purpose.
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