Some simple syncopation suggestions?

[Annoying Twit]

In investigating why too much that I play on the bass sounds the same, I've already had good feedback about choice of scales and triad/chord tones on here.

But, one thing I've worked out is that I don't naturally use syncopation sufficiently in grooves. To the point that as of a short while ago (not now), if I even tried to play the most basic (capitals implies note played on that beat)

one AND two AND three AND four AND

syncopated pattern that without considerable mental effort, I would fall into:

ONE and TWO and THREE and FOUR and

While I want to concentrate on other things right now, are there some simple syncopated patterns that I could add into other practice to improve my use of syncopation. E.g. I've been doing things like this (NB: ONE-ONE means play 16th notes)

ONE-ONE and two AND three AND four and

or, another basic one:

ONE and two AND three and four and

or:

ONE and two AND THREE and four and (not very syncopated I'll admit).

etc.

Are there any patterns that people would recommend. No complicated syncopated triplet rhythms or too complicated 16th note rhythms this week please. Maybe later Though I'm making sure I include basic shuffle every day.

[Bilbo]

Learn to read music.

[Annoying Twit]

[quote name='Bilbo' post='908069' date='Jul 28 2010, 12:13 PM']Learn to read music.[/quote]

I can read music.

[Bloodaxe]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' post='908057' date='Jul 28 2010, 12:06 PM']In investigating why too much that I play on the bass sounds the same, I've already had good feedback about choice of scales and triad/chord tones on here.

But, one thing I've worked out is that I don't naturally use syncopation sufficiently in grooves. To the point that as of a short while ago (not now), if I even tried to play the most basic...

{snip}

Are there any patterns that people would recommend. No complicated syncopated triplet rhythms or too complicated 16th note rhythms this week please. Maybe later Though I'm making sure I include basic shuffle every day.[/quote]
There's a feed-line for some Smutty Innuendo if ever I saw one

Can't help overmuch with the analysis... I get a bit lost with all that at the moment, tbh, & tend to syncopate without thinking too much about it.

Apropos of 'having a daily shuffle' this might be of interest:

[url="http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8453031/Shake_Rattle_%26_Roll-BJT.pdf"]Shake Rattle & Roll - Big Joe Turner PDF[/url] ([url="http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8453031/Shake_Rattle_%26_Roll-BJT.tg"]TuxGuitar Version[/url]). There's a bit of syncopation going on in that.

Pete.

Edited July 28, 2010 by Bloodaxe

[Bilbo]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' post='908076' date='Jul 28 2010, 12:17 PM']I can read music.[/quote]

So find some charts chock full of syncopation and work with them.

[Annoying Twit]

[quote name='Bilbo' post='908091' date='Jul 28 2010, 12:34 PM']So find some charts chock full of syncopation and work with them.[/quote]

That may happen later, but I have a life history of not learning to play real instruments properly, and at this stage in my life, want to work within the parameters of my own foibles. My standard problem is to get sidetracked into something else and go around in circles before giving up again. Right now, for better or for worse, I'm sticking with bass guitar for dummies. But, I can slip in some syncopation into practice by (e.g. using a syncopated rhythm when playing two octave scales etc.) Yes, I realise that this isn't the most logical or best method for learning things, but I'm thinking that my best strategy is to avoid what has caused failure before, and as long as I keep going rather than getting frustrated and quitting, then that's about the best I can expect.

Note that I don't have an expectation of really becoming a virtuoso or anywhere near it on a real instrument, I know that isn't going to happen. My real aim is to be able to do just enough of the multi-instrumentalist thing to record my own amateur original music. And hence when I bought a bass, I was thinking that as long as I can do root root root root, or root fifth root root fifth, then that in itself is enough. My aim is to find little, useful and reusable, things to add onto what I know.

BTW: Once before when I was doing the keyboard thing, I obtained a book called [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Progressive-Bass-Licks-CD-Pack/dp/0947183728/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1280317645&sr=1-1"]"Progressive Bass Licks"[/url] and learned the licks on the keyboard, which considerably opened up they rhythmic tools I had for making up new bass patterns. I can clearly go get the same book again, and do the same. But, I don't want to do this right now. So, what I'm looking for is something very small and minor I can integrate into current practice, without risking being sidetracked too far.

Edited July 28, 2010 by Annoying Twit

[TKenrick]

As I see it, you have two options to begin with:

1. Get hold of this. I'm aware it's not the most exciting thing in the world but it'll certainly solve any issues you have with syncopation:

[url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Modern-Reading-Text-All-Instruments/dp/0769233775/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1280318533&sr=8-1"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Modern-Reading-Tex...8533&sr=8-1[/url]


2. Transcribe things that you find rhythmically interesting and use those ideas in creating your own basslines.

Not necessarily a suggestion, but certainly fairly syncopated:

[gilmour]

Whilst reading and working from charts is important, and will really help develop and understand ideas, I'm not sure anything replaces listening to music. That slightly off topic comment is relevant, but Im guessing if you're aware of it then you're already making steps to remedy it.

Last week at Womad I got to watch Tony Allen and some of that AfroBeat syncopation is incredible - he hardly ever hits the bass drum on the one! But it still gooves like hell...notice how the emphasis is all on the '&' so much so it almost becomes the 1.



Anyway that's my small though on syncopation - listen to something I saw just last week

Edited July 30, 2010 by gilmour

[51m0n]

Stop worrying about the notes.

You only need a single not to be syncopated, so make life easy, this is about how and when you pluck, not about the notes.

So, taking this to the nth degree, its not even about how you play a bass, its about how you subdivide music, so take that bass back off, you aint ready for the bass, you got hands, you gonna clap.

Good reason for this is it a pure rhythm thing, second its about listeing an feeling music, NOT about playing the bass, the music is in you, the bass is a tool to make that music.

Set up a simple 4/4 drum pattern, snare on 2 & 4, kick on 1 & 3 , hats on quavers (1&2&3&4&). About 80 to 90 bpm

Clap with kick.

Thats how you think about music, this is so easy for you right now, you dont even have to try. The longer you do this the more bored you'll get.

SO, clap the snare, this is actually going to make you feel odd, cos it will swing the bar if you do it right, rather than being a bit self conscious, come on move like Stevie, and clap that 2 and 4! There is actually an almost syncopated quiality to this if your really get it going I think.

Keep at it for a minute, really really get zen like about it, you should replace the snare exactly with your clap, but make the groove swing harder.

OK OK, its getting boring again so stop.

Now clap the off beat &'s

1 [b]&[/b] 2 [b]&[/b] 3 [b]&[/b] 4 [b]&[/b]

keep this up for a good few minutes, you should hear a ska feel pumping and bouncing along. If you dont, pu t on some ska and then have another go, you have got to get this one down!

Now a little bit funkier go for this:-

[b]1[/b] & 2 [b]&[/b] 3 [b]&[/b] 4 &

That is a syncopated groove with a heavy one, which is funk (ask Bootsy, thats is what he'll tell you)

OK the best way to count semi-quavers (IMO) is like this:-
1 e & a 2 e & a 3 e & a 4 e & a

So to add a pinch of real syncopation to the mix slow te drum machine down to 70bpm and try this
1 [b]e[/b] & a 2 [b]e[/b] & a 3 [b]e[/b] & a 4 [b]e[/b] & a

and this

1 e & [b]a[/b] 2 e & [b]a[/b] 3 e & [b]a[/b] 4 e & [b]a[/b]

then this (this IS hard)):-

1 [b]e[/b] & [b]a[/b] 2 [b]e[/b] & [b]a[/b] 3 [b]e[/b] & [b]a[/b] 4 [b]e[/b] & [b]a[/b]


Finally a groove:-

[b]1[/b] e & [b]a[/b] 2 e [b]&[/b] a 3 e [b]&[/b] a 4 e & [b]a[/b]



Now pick up your bass, go back to the top of the lesson and only play a low E, staccato to start with and go all the way through these exercises, then legato, then mix and match, have fun.

Now listen to the entire works of The Meters and learn to clap the bass rhythms....

Now you are so syncopated you'll be asking how to play straight!

[Doddy]

One exercise that I've always done is to play a click devided into semi quavers and move the accent on each bar. 'do on the first bar you'll play on 1,the next bar you'll play the 'e',the next bar the &,and so on until you reach the 'a' of 4. It should take you 16 bars.

Another exercise that I nicked from the new Wooten DVD is to again divide the bar in to semi quavers,but this time play a three note pattern(say octaves going low,low,high). Do the same thing as before by moving which sub-division you start on. You can then play the pattern 4 times in a bar,again shifting the note you start on-so you'd play on 1,2,3,4 then the 'e's of 1,2,3,4,then the '&'s and so on.

I hope this makes sense,because I'm on my phone at a gig.

[Pete Academy]

Can syncopation be taught?

[velvetkevorkian]

Yes. It's not magic.

[velvetkevorkian]

Just to expand on my somewhat terse reply, syncopation is to my mind a pretty empirical thing- you're either on the beat or off it. It's not something mystical and hard to define (and therefore teach) like 'groove' or 'funk' or 'locking in'. Obviously using it well and tastefully may be more difficult to master but the basics are relatively straight forward.

[Annoying Twit]

Thanks for all the advice. I'm applying bits and pieces here and there and making progress. Unfortunately I'm not yet at the point where I can just read theory and immediately incorporate it. It takes time before I can actually use it in real time. But, progress is being made, and given my history, that's enough for me.