How do you tell a scam?

[Tait]

I often see on the ebay link section people talking about this is a scam, that is a scam. But half of these I wouldn't have been able to tell it was a scam, and it isn't always that obvious. So I think we should make a list of things to look out for when buying a bass to check if it is some sort of scam.

[99ster]

[quote name='lwtait' post='103441' date='Dec 12 2007, 05:42 PM']I often see on the ebay link section people talking about this is a scam, that is a scam. But half of these I wouldn't have been able to tell it was a scam, and it isn't always that obvious. So I think we should make a list of things to look out for when buying a bass to check if it is some sort of scam.[/quote]


Here's some things to watch for that should at least make you think twice...

1. Price. Scams work by luring gullible people in with bargain prices that they just can't resist. So you do need to have an idea of the realistic market value/price of the item. If it's a £5K vintage bass then the starting price will probably be for £ thousands. A scammer will start the bidding at a silly low price, with no reserve.
2. Photos. A good genuine seller will usually would provide a complete set of good photos.
3. Zero feedback, new seller. Yes - everyone has got to start somewhere...but this is when they definitely need to provide other things to reassure - like cash on collection.
4. 'Private' auction.
5. Locations: Especially the far North of Scotland. I'm sure there are many, many genuine sellers in the far North of Scotland - but it also seems to be overflowing with things like valuable vintage basses! This location has become a favourite of scammers - because how many folks from London (for example) are going to travel from London to check out a bass in Aberdeen??? Or ask awkward questions like 'can I come & check out the bass' or worse still 'I'll pay cash & collect the bass'
6. "FREE" shipping.
7. No offer to pay cash on collection. Any genuine seller will ALWAYS welcome inspection & cash on collection - especially for a valuable bass for example. If they don't then something is wrong.
8. No reply to questions. A genuine seller will always reply & may even provide a phone number for an expensive item like a bass & actively welcome questions...more especially if they are a new seller with 0 feedback.

And you can always post the item here if you are suspicious - there's plenty of folks on BassChat who have a highly developed nose for sniffing out a scam, and who are only too happy to help in stopping them.

Edited December 12, 2007 by 99ster

[WalMan]

What he said although beware photos.

Also look at what else the seller may have for sale and compare backgrounds in the pictures

There seem to have been a spate of items where pictures & even text have been lifted directly from Gumtree, so if you hit two or three of the above a quick search of Gumtree doesn't hurt.

There was a guy who got flagged up here a couple of months back who was a very new eBay registrant with negligible feedback, but who was auctioning a lot of high value guitars & basses. A quick search of Gumtree London in that case found nearly all of the items there as well but clearly being offered by many different sellers dotted all over London

[HarryPotter]

And remember:

[b]If it looks too good to be true then it probably is.[/b]

Edited December 13, 2007 by HarryPotter

[GreeneKing]

I once asked the seller to email me a photo of the bass with that day's newspaper.

He did and I own the bass

[phsycoandy]

i sold a bass once and the buyer said that the neck had broken in the post and would i refund him, I said of course if theres a problem, just send me a picture of the damage, he suddenly dissapeared............

[Dood]

Check out our stickies in this forum.. there is a lot of discussion over how to spot dodgy auctions.

[paul, the]

[quote name='dood' post='104438' date='Dec 14 2007, 06:16 PM']Check out our stickies in this forum.. there is a lot of discussion over how to spot dodgy auctions.[/quote]

I don't think there is.


Can we get this one pinned?

Edited December 29, 2007 by paul, the

[David Nimrod]

[quote name='GreeneKing' post='103698' date='Dec 13 2007, 07:55 AM']I once asked the seller to email me a photo of the bass with that day's newspaper.[/quote]


Excellent idea

I'll be looking forward to using that one...

[The Burpster]

Indeed a good idea. Duly Pinned....

Keep it sensible please folks......

[bnt]

Here's one that raised my hackles: [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FENDER-62-FRETLESS-BASS-LIKE-JACO-BASS-NO-RESERVE-0-01_W0QQitemZ310011369196QQihZ021QQcategoryZ4713QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]link[/url]. Note the item location, yet the listing says "will not post to Asia".

[neepheid]

[quote name='bnt' post='110917' date='Dec 30 2007, 12:42 PM']Here's one that raised my hackles: [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FENDER-62-FRETLESS-BASS-LIKE-JACO-BASS-NO-RESERVE-0-01_W0QQitemZ310011369196QQihZ021QQcategoryZ4713QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]link[/url]. Note the item location, yet the listing says "will not post to Asia". [/quote]

His auctions are always beautifully illustrated and he takes the bass completely to bits and photographs everything. I look forward to his listings just for the eye candy. No scammer would ever take the time and effort that this guy does.

[barneythedog]

I received a second chance offer on a bass recently by email, and after some brief email exchanges I sent my last message as follows;

[i]Hi,

Firstly, if you are a genuine seller then I do apologise, however; the location of the item is listed as Birmingham England, yet you say you are in Greece (did you take all of your for sale items with you?), your ad offers paypal but you want a money transfer, you say the buyer pulled out only 4 hours after he put in a last minute bid (?) yet you have already left positive feedback for him, you claim the sale will be under ebay protection (how????? - that is done via ebay not outside) and for some unknown reason you want me to email you my personal details.

Oh, and YOU GOT MY NAME WRONG.

Forgive me, but I am more than a little skeptical

Thanks[/i]

Just thought it might highlight a few things to look out for

[MacDaddy]

[quote name='HarryPotter' post='103697' date='Dec 13 2007, 07:53 AM']And remember:

[b]If it looks too good to be true then it probably is.[/b][/quote]

On Ebay maybe, but there have been some stunning deals on here!

[bremen]

Always a good idea to ask for the serial number then Google it and see where else it appears. You can also cross-reference serial number and alleged year of manufacture; here for Fenders: [url="http://www.fender.com/support/usa_instruments.php"]http://www.fender.com/support/usa_instruments.php[/url]

[kdphysio]

[quote name='barneythedog' post='134750' date='Feb 6 2008, 12:00 AM']I received a second chance offer on a bass recently by email, and after some brief email exchanges I sent my last message as follows;

[i]Hi,

Firstly, if you are a genuine seller then I do apologise, however; the location of the item is listed as Birmingham England, yet you say you are in Greece (did you take all of your for sale items with you?), your ad offers paypal but you want a money transfer, you say the buyer pulled out only 4 hours after he put in a last minute bid (?) yet you have already left positive feedback for him, you claim the sale will be under ebay protection (how????? - that is done via ebay not outside) and for some unknown reason you want me to email you my personal details.

Oh, and YOU GOT MY NAME WRONG.

Forgive me, but I am more than a little skeptical

Thanks[/i]

Just thought it might highlight a few things to look out for [/quote]


i had a similar '2nd chance offer' apparently from this seller (musicgearguy6), but after emails were exchanged, he told me that the guitars had been sold, so were no longer for sale.

apparently his account had been hacked into, and whoever it was had put all his stuff up for 2nd chance offers hoping to get money from bidders who lost the auction!

scum-bag!

[barneythedog]

aye, scum bag!

If this is true then I retract any criticism I have made of this particular seller.

However my post still serves as an illustration of some things to look out for.

Edited February 7, 2008 by barneythedog

[iamapirate]

[quote name='GreeneKing' post='103698' date='Dec 13 2007, 07:55 AM']I once asked the seller to email me a photo of the bass with that day's newspaper.

He did and I own the bass [/quote]
GENIUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't wait to use that now!! just try looking for the photoshop'd lines!

[Hodge]

There's alot of suggestions here for questions to ask suspected scammers.

I'd have to say if you have serious doubts about the legitimacy of a seller then don't even send them a message.

I had an experience several years ago, it was an Eden head of some sort if I recall. The seller had all the tell-tale signs....
payment via Western Union, a hotmail address for contact etc. although his feedback was very good.
I contacted him to ask about cash on collection and got some story about having a policy of not meeting strangers off the internet, protecting his family etc.

That settled the matter for me and I took it off my watching list and forgot about it.

A week or so later I had recieved several messages from irate buyers wanting to know where their goods were.

It turned out that somehow, through my contact with him, or possibly it was through my watching of the item???...dunno how these things work, but basically he'd hacked my account and used it to stick up a new batch of scams, benefitting from my 100% positive feedback.

I contacted Ebay security and they immediately sorted the matter out, removing all auctions in my name, contacting buyers and even removed negative feedback I'd recieved due to non-arrival of goods.

It all worked out in the end, for me at least, but it just goes to show that there are risks in merely contacting someone you suspect may be a scammer.

[JPAC]

I was thinking of buying a mobile phone off eBay, how do you tell if they're stolen or genuine?

[Musky]

[quote name='Hodge' post='529670' date='Jul 1 2009, 03:43 PM']There's alot of suggestions here for questions to ask suspected scammers.

I'd have to say if you have serious doubts about the legitimacy of a seller then don't even send them a message.

I had an experience several years ago, it was an Eden head of some sort if I recall. The seller had all the tell-tale signs....
payment via Western Union, a hotmail address for contact etc. although his feedback was very good.
I contacted him to ask about cash on collection and got some story about having a policy of not meeting strangers off the internet, protecting his family etc.

That settled the matter for me and I took it off my watching list and forgot about it.

A week or so later I had recieved several messages from irate buyers wanting to know where their goods were.

It turned out that somehow, through my contact with him, or possibly it was through my watching of the item???...dunno how these things work, but basically he'd hacked my account and used it to stick up a new batch of scams, benefitting from my 100% positive feedback.

I contacted Ebay security and they immediately sorted the matter out, removing all auctions in my name, contacting buyers and even removed negative feedback I'd recieved due to non-arrival of goods.

It all worked out in the end, for me at least, but it just goes to show that there are risks in merely contacting someone you suspect may be a scammer.[/quote]

That's a strange one. I've heard of scams where people have been phished by accusing a seller of duplicating another auction and posted a link as proof. Of course the link takes you too a fake Ebay log in page and they get your (and anyone else who was interested in the auction) password that way. If your email included your name it's also possible they could have sent you a convincing looking email from 'Ebay' and phished you that way.

How were you certain that it was the same guy responsible for hacking your account?

[Tait]

[quote name='Musky' post='529886' date='Jul 1 2009, 07:35 PM']That's a strange one. I've heard of scams where people have been phished by accusing a seller of duplicating another auction and posted a link as proof. Of course the link takes you too a fake Ebay log in page and they get your (and anyone else who was interested in the auction) password that way. If your email included your name it's also possible they could have sent you a convincing looking email from 'Ebay' and phished you that way.

How were you certain that it was the same guy responsible for hacking your account?[/quote]

obviously i dont agree with scams, but you gotta give it to them, this is quite clever.

Edited July 1, 2009 by Tait

[Hodge]

[quote name='Musky' post='529886' date='Jul 1 2009, 07:35 PM']That's a strange one. I've heard of scams where people have been phished by accusing a seller of duplicating another auction and posted a link as proof. Of course the link takes you too a fake Ebay log in page and they get your (and anyone else who was interested in the auction) password that way. If your email included your name it's also possible they could have sent you a convincing looking email from 'Ebay' and phished you that way.

How were you certain that it was the same guy responsible for hacking your account?[/quote]

Well as to how it was done I really have no clue. All I know is that I sent the guy an email (to be honest I can't remember if it was via the eBay messaging service or direct to the hotmail address he gave in the auction) and a day or two later there were alot of dodgy auctions on my account. I'm assuming the contact I had with him was somehow involved, since I've never had a problem with my account security before or since. I'm pretty sure that had I not contacted him I wouldn't have had any problems, unless, of course, you have any other explanation that doesn't involve a thoroughly staggering coincidence?

As to how I know it was the same bloke...... the Eden head I'd originally enquired about was among the items falsely listed on my account and I also recognised a couple of other items that had been in the "view sellers other items" when I was first looking at the Eden.

Just to clarify, the scam wasn't perpetrated by the owner of the account on which I first saw the Eden, his account had also been hacked in order to list the items, hence the good feedback. So this particular scammer had a chain going on, where he'd hack an account, list some spurious auctions, then anyone who contacted him would also find themselves hacked and unknowingly selling the same items and so on and so on.....

[Annoying Twit]

[quote name='Hodge' post='530795' date='Jul 2 2009, 03:44 PM']Well as to how it was done I really have no clue. All I know is that I sent the guy an email (to be honest I can't remember if it was via the eBay messaging service or direct to the hotmail address he gave in the auction) and a day or two later there were alot of dodgy auctions on my account. I'm assuming the contact I had with him was somehow involved, since I've never had a problem with my account security before or since. I'm pretty sure that had I not contacted him I wouldn't have had any problems, unless, of course, you have any other explanation that doesn't involve a thoroughly staggering coincidence?[/quote]

An email may contain the IP address of the originating computer. If so, and if that computer is not properly protected, then the bad guy might try attacking the computer remotely. If the computer is successfully compromised the bad guy then might install a key logger. If this is done, then since the bad guy knows your ebay username, it would be easy to look through the key log for the username followed by a potential password.

[harlowbassplayer]

i think i have found a scammer on BassChat i sent an bass and he said it got damaged (neck and tuner) in the post and i asked him to show me the damages and he got pay pal to refund him the money but i'm still waiting for these photo's this was on 24/03/11 plus he still isn't replying to my email's on Hotmail or bass chat and pay pal