MM Roasted Necks

[RayFW]

For a "light the blue touchpaper" moment, try posting that your Ray has lower output from the G string.

[obbm]

[quote name='Lfalex v1.1' post='924816' date='Aug 14 2010, 12:27 PM']I'm surprised that they haven't issued a Fatwa on Rob Green for making replacement Graphite necks and imposed sanctions against East, Bartolini, MEC, Seymour Duncan, et al for having the temerity to manufacture electronics/pick-ups...

BTW, If I made Wah pedals, I would most certainly name one of mine "FatWah" and maybe "AutoFatWah" [/quote]

Surely it would hve to be a "PhatWah".

[Waldo]

[quote name='RayFW' post='924821' date='Aug 14 2010, 12:40 PM']For a "light the blue touchpaper" moment, try posting that your Ray has lower output from the G string.
[/quote]

This is ridiculous though, it's a rife problem with those basses but the attitude is just fingers in ears 'la la la'.

[Chris2112]

It's such a shame. I've emailed Phil Kubicki and Rob at Status in the past with queries about instruments I had bought used, and they were always spot on and prompt to reply to my emails. I asked Phil for advice on changing the strings when I first had a Kubicki Ex Factor and he emailed me a step by step guide and gave me his phone number incase I needed step by step advice on the phone! Incredible customer service!

Whereas I fear if you went onto the EBMM forum and said "I want to tongue BP's rim" you'd still get flamed and knocked back because there are people with 5 or 6 MM basses there who haven't yet got to do that!

[risingson]

Wow, what a terrible excuse for a managing director of a company. It's really frustrating to read as I'm a big fan of Ernie Balls and would have looked at getting one in the next few months, certainly, but honestly I'd think twice now. As far as I'm concerned, if you can't take a little criticism or speculation from prospective clients, then stop surrounding yourself with sycophantic arse-lickers and get out of the kitchen.

[SignsOfDelirium_bassist]

Almost tempts me to go and start sh*t just for the fun of it, it really does...Start threads like "Who here's got a status neck for their MM?" just to see the reactions...

[Delberthot]

I was nearly burned at the stake on the Rickresource for suggesting that Lemmy's Rick was a copy and having a Rick signature model made for him wouldn't make sense as he's never played a real one.


Just like posting on Talkbs that Jaco was pish


I like a larf

Edited August 14, 2010 by Delberthot

[Prime_BASS]

I'm gonna slice and dice my SUB, so all that's left is the body and bridge and go show it them.

What are they like towards the OLP's?

I'm sure they will all claim they are crap repos that don't deserve the 'ernie ball' name on the back.....All though I'm sure they were only pulled cause sales were up against the real deal?

[Big_Stu]

[quote name='Delberthot' post='924978' date='Aug 14 2010, 04:13 PM']I was nearly burned at the stake on the Rickresource for suggesting that Lemmy's Rick was a copy and having a Rick signature model made for him wouldn't make sense as he's never played a real one.


Just like posting on Talkbs that Jaco was pish


I like a larf[/quote]

Saw one of their gigs in Glasgow where both of his custom jobs kept dying on him & he was switching them about.

Edited August 14, 2010 by Big_Stu

[Prime_BASS]

I'm gonna slice and dice my SUB, so all that's left is the body and bridge and go show it them.

What are they like towards the OLP's?

I'm sure they will all claim they are crap repos that don't deserve the 'ernie ball' name on the back.....All though I'm sure they were only pulled cause sales were up against the real deal?

[Machines]

It's a terrible forum, you haven't got a chance of a fair discussion in there, far too much bias. Fair enough it is administered by the company itself - but their attitude is very pompous and arrogant, they will not accept criticism. I'm sure once someone got flamed for wanting to replace the OEM pickup and discussing what would be a good replacement, apparently discussing 'competitor products' is very rude.

[stingrayPete1977]

Do as do and dont go there.....

[thodrik]

I know its a forum for the company, so you can expect a bit of brand loyalty, but it seems a bit over the top. Not good customer relations really. Still, they do make nice basses that are about as good as you get for mass production models. I would still take a Fender that works though.

Score one for Sadowsky, Vigier, Status, Overwater et al.

[Starless]

These company forums are a waste of space as inevitably ( and understandably) you can't freely express any less than favourable opinions. As previously mentioned, the RickResource forum is an amazing temple of worship for all things Ric-shaped. It is not company affiliated, but I would suggest that Ric's head honcho himself is not averse to tapping the admins on the shoulder every so often when something crops up that casts a less than favourable light on some aspect of Rics.

An amazing thread some time back, where a newbie, keen-as-mustard Ric fan told the story of how he loved Rics but could never afford one. So he poured over photos of them and eventually made his own one. He was that keen, it was a remarkable thing to have done and he proudly showed pics of his handiwork.

The poor guy was hung, drawn and quartered by the resident zealots. 'Trademark infringement', 'Sacrilidge!', 'Copies devalue the purity of US made Rics' etc etc.

Poor guy must have wished he hadn't bothered.

Being US moderated doesn't help in these places either. Irony, Sarc, tongue-in-cheek just don't seem to register on that side of the pond quite the same way it would on this side... as I found to my own amusement when I got banned for trying to be 'funny'. It hadn't helped that up to that point I had been extolling the virtues of an aftermarket replacement bridge for the 4003 (sacrilidge!). My card was marked and I had my plug pulled.

Beware the brand-centric forum - therein lurks a competely irrational devotion to the logo and all common sense and any semblance of free-speech flies out of the window.

(basically they're all run by loonies).

Edited August 14, 2010 by Starless

[Grand Wazoo]

Ok everyone, I am sure you have all vented your opinions in regards to the Ernie Ball forum and in regards to Sterling Ball.

Well now if you'll allow me, I would also like to have my chance to say my piece but I am really hoping you will all listen to what is truly an unbiased point of view and one which looks at it in retrospective, a kind of a reality check for all those who have expressed reservations towards EB forum and BP to help them understand and appreciate the difference betewen a "corporate" forum and one as open as this which is dedicated to the bass as an instrument and it is not run/owned by any major manufacturers the likes of Ibanez, Warwick, Fender etc etc.

A brief admittance from my side, so you further understand where I am coming from, my thinking is very much along the lines of you all, a true forum of discussion should be open to all and should honour all topics and shouldn't be so heavily moderated and castrated, I am a member of that forum too with the exact same username, I am not denying or hiding that very fact. Being as liberally minded as most of you are, I have had countless runnings with BP, in fact I don't believe he likes me much because my biggest defect is that I would call a spade a spade and I won't keep quiet when I am argued against, as a result, a lot of my threads and posts have been locked / deleted etc.

All these acts from him and his dobermans have often offended me, hurt me in my pride and you would ask why do you keep visiting the forum, well simply because 1) I really like their instruments, I have 4 EBMM basses and I am not one to spend the cash just because I am on a rat race to keep up with the Jones, that is not why I buy EBMM basses, I do it because I truly value the instruments and I get a lot of enjoyment from owning them. If you know me, you'd know that I would very seldom sell a bass on if it wasn't because I was truly unsatisfied with it and 2) I have made a lot of friends in there from various corners of the world, people who share my same interest and those with whom I have exchanged ideas and traded helpful tips.

Returning to the way that forum is run, yes I agree it is heavy handed to the uninitiated, but we really can't argue with that because you know that after all it is a [b]corporate forum[/b] dedicated entirely to the Ernie Ball stuff and while I do agree there should be kinder ways to deal with people, example those asking if they recommend after market pickups for a Stingray, etc etc, but really what do you expect? They make them, from the woods to the electrics, the pickup etc etc, it is their registered mark property, in which they have invested capital to produce and distribute, it is obvious that they are not going to say, well stick a Seymour Duncan in that, you'll get a much better overall balanced sound, and that is barely an example I am sure you guys would have witnessed more of similar nature. Some guy would get a hard time, simply because he expressed disappointment at the lack of colour choice on a given bass, other would get troncated and their threads locked for asking if there are known replacement parts other than the ones available directly from EBMM.
In fact Ernie Ball would not sell you one of their pickups unless you send back a faulty one so on and so on. Their goal is to protect their intellectual copyrighted material. Full stop, if you were the boss, you would also have the tendency to look after your business.

We can argue that point to oblivion but at the end of the day, we must accept it and take it on board, it is their forum, it's their name is on the doors, they have a company to safeguard, employees to pay wages to, and the employees have families to feed. Without the employees there would be no production. EBMM behind their apparent bad points have been actually awarded as a living wage employer who treat their staff respectfully and provide them with a secure job regardless of the strict economic times we are in, where Chrysler, Ford and General Motors are laying off 1000's of staff because they can't afford to pay them, why? Because they are not selling the same amount of cars that they had budgeted 10 years ago, and I am not going off topic because my correlation to this is that Ernie Ball are not selling as many basses as they would want to, they have openly said it in the forum and regardless of that they are keeping their staff on but they have to streamline their production to products which will really sell and their marketing nowadays is really crucial, they must produce basses in colours that Joe public will really buy, i.e. traditional colours like black, sunburst or natural. Which is why their colour choice must be limited to the colours which market research database proves as a definite seller, I guess one person might like a purple / green bass but not 10 millions and if they make that many, and they don't sell them they are in trouble.

Now as I've said before, I have had plenty runnings with Sterling Ball because our characters have divaricated opinions, and as a result I am not in a position to consider him a "pal of mine" as much as he wouldn't consider me one but... I have to say that actions speak louder than words and while he can appear to be a bit rough handed when he deals with "infidels" like me, he is not without a big heart and a really serious sense of business accumen.

He is a very charitable man, as a father of a disabled teenager myself I can forget all about his being a bit of a brat, having learnt that he has done many charitable things that have really moved me, and I am sure a lot of people who have learnt about these things would "get him" too. His son was born with a kidney disease and he had has donated one of his kidneys to his own son, well you might think any father would do that, yes we all woud but being in his position and in contact with many famous people from both music and sport he set up a charity called the Casey Lee Ball (his son's name) dedicated to pediatric kidney research [url="http://www.ernieball.com/clb/"][b]see this link[/b][/url] where he reguarly offers his own instruments for sale at auctions, these end up making big bucks and all proceeds goes to that charity, he also patrons other charities but they are too many to list.

To add more to the understanding of the way the man is, you'll also find that he has helped a forum member who was diagnosed with a brain tumor by setting up a collection in the forum where people were donating via paypal for him to pay for his medical expenses as you know in the US there's no such a thing as the NHS and people have to pay for their treatment, also he donated the bass he was buying to him for free because before the collection was started he had to cancel his order as the tumour was diagnosed and he couldn't afford to buy his bass anymore, you can read more about it in here actually [url="http://www.pittsburghcitypaper.ws/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A70743"]http://www.pittsburghcitypaper.ws/gyrobase...oid=oid%3A70743[/url] Now if that type of collection was started in this forum I doubt we would have reached $9000 in 3 days. Why was the response so effective? Because Sterling wrote a few basic lines that moved everyone who read them in which he was coaching people to dig deep in their pocket and offer anything from a $1.00 to as much as they could afford. Yes there are many who idolize the man but when he gets the ball rolling on something there is no stopping him, that's for sure.

The list goes on, there was another forum member whose wife was also diagnosed with cancer and he made a bass for him with the cancer charity logo who Sterling Ball also is a registered charity supporter.

As I've said the list goes on, and yes the man might soung like a knob, if I was to be honest I would say I am not very fond of his character but even I can see that he has his heart in the right place and a business is a business, you can't expect it to run it without safegurading your interest. In other words you can't make an omelette without cracking some eggs.

Make what you may of it but surely before you comment / disagree or diss you really need to do your homework first.

By the way I am back from my holiday and I am at work again on Monday I had a great time, met a lot of cool people and some crazy ones too.

Finally I need to add a point which I forgot to clarify, someone said "Who does BP think he is, not as if he designed the Stingray" well the truth is, that Leo Fender indeed designed / invented the Stingray, but it was a young Sterling Ball who worked for Leo at the time, who being a bass player which Leo wasn't and Sterling Ball beta tested the bass and provided Leo with the tips and feedback which in the end helped shaping the final production item which we now all know as the Stingray, perhaps without BP the Stingray might not have been as succesful as it has been, again you can read all about it in here: [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MusicMan"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MusicMan[/url]

There is this quote there too: [size=2][i][b]"These instruments were designed by Leo Fender and Forrest White. Sterling Ball assisted in the design of the bass"[/b][/i][/size]

The way Sterling Ball moved the company forward from the take over of Music Man selling Stingrays to all the current models, Big Al, 25th Anniversary/Reflex, Bongo, and Sterling basses, well you can't deny the magnitude of their quality and public response.

Edited August 15, 2010 by Grand Wazoo

[stingrayPete1977]

Thats the longest response I have ever read on any forum,Well done!

[Ou7shined]

[quote name='Grand Wazoo' post='925318' date='Aug 15 2010, 05:12 AM']Ok everyone, I am sure you have all vented your opinions in regards to the Ernie Ball forum and in regards to Sterling Ball......
.......Make what you may of it but surely before you comment / disagree or diss you really need to do your homework first.[/quote]
So in essence you're saying he's a knob but does some charity work so give him a break.

I've been a member on there for a few years now and found it to be a fairly pointless exercise. I've asked a few technical questions and never really got any satisfactory answers that weren't already available at the privately run musicmanbass.org. I guess it's an ok forum for folk who want to buy new all the time but compared to the likes of the G&L forums who are run by passionate fans it is little more than a drop in point for sycophants.

[Ou7shined]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='924535' date='Aug 13 2010, 11:48 PM']I recon ou7shined should go over their with his Pingray and tell them it's the better than a real Stingray.
.........[/quote]
Hahaha. Do you double dare me?

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='Ou7shined' post='925368' date='Aug 15 2010, 09:55 AM']Hahaha. Do you double dare me? [/quote]

Yes I do. It's a geniune ray pickup and pickguard so it may get some kudos "/

I guess you are right that he isn't a total nob.
I just wonder if the answer to the posed question would have been so severe if the questioner hadn't mentioned "marketing".

I do understand he was a better tester for the ray, and having been beta tester for a number of different video games(not the same thing I know but good example) I know how much or little input you get, for final fantasy XIII the game plays largely different for call of duty it was just glitch finding.

There is protecting brand image and then there is being down right untruthful to make sure you make a few quid.

[Musicman20]

GW - Thanks for the reply, and Im with you on this one some what. I can agree it can appear a little aggressive on that forum, as I stated before. BUT, it is his company.

I admire the EB instruments, despite the fact I ended up with a weird neck on a Classic. I STILL would buy without testing. They dont mess about with these basses.

I think the whole idea of not allowing people to 'buy' Ray pickups, for example, is a good one.

What really made me think was when various members of the EB forum stated that people are obviously free to add what they want to their basses, BUT, the electronics in the basses are designed specifically for that bass. That's why personally Id NEVER change the electrics in an EBMM. Absolutely no point. if you dont like the sound, dont buy it. They are meant to be a bass you can buy, play, and really enjoy.

[paul h]

Brilliant post GW. Very good job of expressing your opinion and also giving the reasons for it. Nice one. However, IMHO none of that excuses rudeness, especially in a conversation between what is essentially a retailer a customer. Plenty of people do great things for charity and manage not to be complete nobs at the same time.

[Machines]

[quote name='paul h' post='925680' date='Aug 15 2010, 04:34 PM']However, IMHO none of that excuses rudeness, especially in a conversation between what is essentially a retailer a customer. Plenty of people do great things for charity and manage not to be complete nobs at the same time.[/quote]
This is the issue I have personally, he seems to have disassociated himself from customer service by thinking it has to be sacrificed to protect the brand.

[Stacker]

[quote name='Delberthot' post='924978' date='Aug 14 2010, 04:13 PM']I was nearly burned at the stake on the Rickresource for suggesting that Lemmy's Rick was a copy and having a Rick signature model made for him wouldn't make sense as he's never played a real one.


Just like posting on Talkbs that Jaco was pish


I like a larf[/quote]

Rickresource = Nazis, esp 'BangleJangle' or whatever he's called. He sparks up bigstyle and is frightfully rude. And, yeh, I got it in the neck there, too, for stating that the LK looked like cuckoo clock leftovers!

But that SB carry on - maybe it's a Yank thing, cos JH at RIC is kinda cutting, too!

[martthebass]

[quote name='paul h' post='925680' date='Aug 15 2010, 04:34 PM']Brilliant post GW. Very good job of expressing your opinion and also giving the reasons for it. Nice one. However, IMHO none of that excuses rudeness, especially in a conversation between what is essentially a retailer a customer. Plenty of people do great things for charity and manage not to be complete nobs at the same time.[/quote]

I think that was essentially where I was coming from at tthe start of this thread. It appeared to me that BP was abusing his position by belittling a customer who had made a post on a public (albeit company owned/run) forum. Not big and not clever.

[Prime_BASS]

At work if a guest (customer but it's company policy to say guest) questioned something on the menu, or asked how something was done, I'd have to tell them honestly and politly as best I could. If I gave a kinda typical sterling ball answer, I'd get the sack.....

But by sterling balls policy, I can be as rude and hateful as I like cause it would be in the companies building....

You would think the owner of a company would be setting the standard for customer relations, not dis-regarding it.

This is how I see it. I know it's only the Internet at the end of the day, and part of me hopes that he wouldn't be such a jerk if posed a question in the street, but I'm sure he would be.