Band Equipment

[flyfisher]

I guess we all have our own bass gear and wouldn't want it any other way, but what about general band equipment such as PA systems and lighting?

I'm thinking in the context of a 'mates' band who gig for fun and get paid with beer and food, so there's no income to fund new gear.

If all the band members chip in to buy a PA system, what happens when one of those band members leave (or is sacked?).

Just wondering how other bands manage this sort of thing.

[Master blaster]

A lot of bands i know leave it up to the singer to buy the PA system. The guitarists and bass players buy there own application, drummer buy there own kits so to me it makes sense for the singer to buy the PA for there vocals to go through.

[Truckstop]

Yeah totally. Im sick and tired of vocalists never stumping up for their own gear! Most vocalists I've ever played with always managed to find a mic from somewhere/someone and they always get given mics at gigs. Ridiculous!

Truckstop

[flyfisher]

Interesting point, I hadn't thought about the vocalist angle. But what if a 'vocal-only' PA systems needs to be upgraded to include a sub-woofer, remote mixer, stage monitors for all, snakes and other bits?

[Master blaster]

Its more expensive but when my band plays a gig that requires the full backline as well as the vocals going through the PA, we hire a sound guy. To cover the costs we negotiate with the venue to up our fee. For small pubs or venues you shouldn't need to milk it with a big PA setup.

Edited August 19, 2010 by Master blaster

[farmer61]

Quite straight forward IMO.

Any shared eqpt everyone has equal dibs.

If I choose to leave the band, I forgo my share. If I'm fired, I'm paid my share less depreciation.

Did this when I left my old band, didn't think it was right for the band to pay me, when it was totally my choice to leave. If you get an agreement in place before spending it should be really straight forward.

Edited August 19, 2010 by farmer61

[Lozz196]

[quote name='farmer61' post='929851' date='Aug 19 2010, 02:19 PM']Quite straight forward IMO.

Any shared eqpt everyone has equal dibs.

If I choose to leave the band, I forgo my share. If I'm fired, I'm paid my share less depreciation.

Did this when I left my old band, didn't think it was right for the band to pay me, when it was totally my choice to leave. If you get an agreement in place before spending it should be really straight forward.[/quote]
The poster above quoted exactly the same as what we had in my last band.

Tho once the whole band disolved, the pa was sold off and everyone who had been in the band over the years was given a share, as the reasons for leaving were things like emigrating, wife having baby etc, so not acrimonious departures. The only person who didn`t get a pay-out was a guy who was sacked.

[algmusic]

For function bands, usually the person who owns the gear or pays for it, get a slightly bigger cut of the pie for the gigs, which I think is fair. I'm in a trio function band and we've all paid for our own leads and mics, but the Speakers/subs/lights/mixer/leads were paid by the singer/guitarist..

That said if a singer (who only sings), buys the gear, I think it should be split equally, maybe minus subs or lights.. My bass/cab/leads/strings/straps/insurance/amp/racks... costs a lot more than a small light SM58, or if they are fancy a beta 58 ..rant over breathe .. relax :-)

[JTUK]

Why would you play with a vocalist without his own P.A.?

We have to fund our own gear to the tune of a few thousand to play, and so should he/she.
If they don't have any gear, then they have never done anything..which would be risky playing with them, IMV or they
can't/don't get gigs on their own..so same rule applies.

No, seriously, why would you entertain this idea..?
On a band-split, people take out what they put in.. less any losses, but 99% of vocalists who don't have access to a PA aren't going to be worth bothering with..IMO.

[flyfisher]

[quote name='JTUK' post='929927' date='Aug 19 2010, 03:32 PM']Why would you play with a vocalist without his own P.A.?[/quote]
Fair point, but the band already had a vocals-only PA when I joined, which they had paid for among themselves. I'm not really sure of the arrangement between them. So I'm thiinking more about any new gear we buy as a band from now on.

Personally, I think I'd prefer to buy whole items myself and retain ownership whether I leave or get sacked. Seems like a better investment that way. But some interesting comments nevertheless.

[Doddy]

I'd really try to avoid the whole 'band PA' thing. I don't believe it's a good way of handling things,as often it
is likely to cause arguments down the line.
If you must all go in on a rig,why not split it up, ie. one of you buys and owns the lights,another buys and
owns the monitors etc. At least then,everyone knows who owns what and it makes the inevitable split easier.

[bumnote]

Shared ownership always seems to cause aggravation

We are three piece where the guitarist does 75% of the singing. I own the subs, tops and poles
Ron owns the mixer, echo and one power amp [its biamped] anf the drummer the other one and the crossover.

If one leaves he takes his own stuff with him or offers to sell it to the band

[Cat Burrito]

[quote name='Doddy' post='930171' date='Aug 19 2010, 06:52 PM']If you must all go in on a rig,why not split it up, ie. one of you buys and owns the lights,another buys and
owns the monitors etc. At least then,everyone knows who owns what and it makes the inevitable split easier.[/quote]

Good advice.

I've been involved twice in the purchasing of kit as a band. Set the rules at the time & it means you buy people out when you sack them or split. Money can definitely be the end of beautiful relationships

[thisnameistaken]

We don't share ownership of anything, it just seems like a really bad idea.

[Marvin]

I wouldn't be mad on shared ownership. If it was a vocal only PA that's the vocalists department, anything bigger I'd rather take less money from the gigs and leave more for the person(s) who own the PA.

[flyfisher]

[quote name='Doddy' post='930171' date='Aug 19 2010, 06:52 PM']I'd really try to avoid the whole 'band PA' thing. I don't believe it's a good way of handling things,as often it
is likely to cause arguments down the line.
If you must all go in on a rig,why not split it up, ie. one of you buys and owns the lights,another buys and
owns the monitors etc. At least then,everyone knows who owns what and it makes the inevitable split easier.[/quote]
Yep, that's my feeling as well.

I suppose it could open up an argument about how to share out any band income in terms of the individual member's capital investments, but I think we're a long way from having to worry about that.

[Ian Savage]

For paid gigs, I've always treated any shared gear used (van, PA, lights etc) as an extra 'band member' when divvying up the money, whether it's owned by the band or by one person.

[algmusic]

[quote name='Ian Savage' post='930856' date='Aug 20 2010, 01:01 PM']For paid gigs, I've always treated any shared gear used (van, PA, lights etc) as an extra 'band member' when divvying up the money, whether it's owned by the band or by one person.[/quote]

+1 the van is a fair point if everyone jumps in the van as well

[Doddy]

[quote name='flyfisher' post='930807' date='Aug 20 2010, 12:21 PM']I suppose it could open up an argument about how to share out any band income in terms of the individual member's capital investments, but I think we're a long way from having to worry about that. [/quote]

If one guy owns the all the PA and/or the communal van then they should get a larger cut,but if everyone owns certain pieces of gear and drives themselves
you can divvy up the money evenly.

[ironside1966]

I makes sense for the vocalist to own the PA if it is a backline band but most of the bands I have worked for carry large expensive rigs, a light shows and a large van. Often the band is run by one or two people who run everything and pay wages to the rest.
It will only be viable carrying a large PA if you are earning the money, when the PA is owned by the band any member who leaves or gets sack should be paid their percentages of the realistic value of the gear unless the leave they leave without working their notice. If the band splits then the gear is sold.
I would agree everything before hand and then sign a contract you know what some musicians are like best friends one minute complete C++-s the next especially when money is involved.

[2pods]

I'm owed a blue light from a few years ago, from the lighting rig we bought, but what would I do with a blue light ?
I thought they could keep it as a memento

[Lee-7]

When I am not gigging with my band I do the sound for my fathers outfit, being a named band they play at a lot of big venues up & down the country, if it is Butlins no gear to take apart from guitars, cymbals etc. Any other job I sort it out.

My father owns the van which has been kitted out to seat everyone, the PA system and also provides the rhythm guitarists amp and all SM58 mics, it is run as a business so everything is done properly. All good gear.

In my band though, everything is split between the 3 of us, we don't include the lead guitarist when new gear is being bought because he is a tight arse who winges at anything to do with spending brass, doesn't mind spending £40 in the pub but ask for £40 towards some extra gear that will earn money and you would think the world was about to end. So this reason we keep it bewteen just the 3 of us.

The deal is that if any of us leave, we get a percentage back, this arrangement is ok if money is tight. If I was financially flying I would buy it all, then there is only me to worry about.

Bands are never straight forward, a bit like a marriage...........

[fonzoooroo]

We all own our own individual kit, and each drive ourselves to gigs. The (vocals only) PA's the singers, I own a pair of wedges and a power amp to drive them. It grabs me that's the way to treat gear - own and be responsible for "sections" of the kit (monitors/lights/pa/subs)... That way, if MY power amp dies, I'M responsible for getting it fixed, I'M responsible for looking after it, etc.

The logic extends if you've got a couple more members in the band, but fails when you've got a horn section... Annoying when the singer owns the monitors, trumpet player the PA, me and the guitarist lugging monster backline, and the ("I don't know where to plug this wire in") alto sax player getting paid the same for turning up with a sax and a stand! ... That day, you really need to start adjusting payments to suit.